Episode 994: HomePod Rumors and Apple TV Chat

Introduction

0:00This episode is brought to you by Accenture. When your advertising operations fall out of sync, everything else follows. Spotify and Accenture are working together to reinvent the rhythm of ad sales, using automation, analytics, and smarter workflows to simplify campaign delivery and access better data across the business. The result? Less time spent on operations, more time connecting brands with the moments and fandoms that matter most. Learn more at Accenture.com slash Spotify.

Host Introduction

0:30Welcome to the Macworld Podcast. My name is Michael Simon, and I am joined by, you know, Jason, I was going to call you senior editor today because I figured it's a good day to mix things up. So I am joined by senior editor, Jason Cross. Good morning. And our special guest producer, Brennan King. What's up, y'all? Brennan is filling in for Roman,

1:02who is on vacation in Iceland to see the eclipse, which we talked a lot about last week. Yeah, I love that for him. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, it's one of those trips that once in a lifetime, I guess, maybe twice in a lifetime. I don't know. How many times does the eclipse go through Iceland? I actually have no idea. But probably once in his lifetime. Yeah, it'll be great. You know, I can't wait to hear all the hijinks from him about it. It'll be fun. Yeah, Roman is definitely one to share,

1:34to overly share stories once he comes back. He'll just say, yeah, it was all right. It was all right. Yeah, he's my desk neighbor here. So we've been steadily yapping about it. Yeah.

Smart Home Discussion

1:49So welcome, Brennan. Thanks. Happy to be here. And this is episode number 994. And today we're going to talk about smart home stuff. So we're getting the new Siri in like, I don't know, five weeks now. It's close. So once Apple ships that to everybody. Probably second week of September or something. Yeah, 15th or something, whatever it is, 14th, 13th, whenever that Monday is. Monday after the iPhone event.

2:20So once we get that with iOS 27 and all the other 27s, that should open the door to all these things that we've been hearing about for a long time. Like that HomePad, iPad, dock thing, a new Apple TV, a new HomePod mini, like a doorbell, accessories, a pin, a pendant, there's all sorts of stuff. So we'll get into all that.

This Week in Apple History

2:44Then we'll do it this week in Apple history and we will close. Oh, crap. I didn't get any comments. Jason, did you get comments? I totally forgot about comment. I can go grab some from the social media. Or Brennan, did you get comments? I did not get comments. I forgot about we're supposed to do comment. We might not have comment corner today, people. We will see. If Jason can multitask while we're talking, maybe we'll have comment corner. Sure, I can find a way to do that. Hang on. But speaking of comments, for next week, you can contact us through Blue Sky Facebook or Threads.

3:16Search for Macworld. Look for the Blue Mouse logo. Send emails to podcast at macworld.com.

3:22Comment under a video, comment under a post. Send us a personal email because obviously we aren't looking anywhere else right now because Roman's not here. And we'll talk about them all on a future show. I can't believe I forgot to do that, Jason. I'm going to blame Roman for this, even though he's in Iceland. He could have reminded me. It is entirely our fault. And yeah, we can blame him. Sorry. We didn't get anything new in the podcast email inbox. I can tell you that. But I'll grab a couple comments off of videos and stuff.

3:54It's easy. All right.

Apple TV Discussion

3:56So before we do that and the smart home stuff, let's just talk a bit about Apple TV. This is a bit of a selfish personal segment because I finished watching Widow's Bay this weekend. That was great. Yeah, man. I loved it. It was like the whole thing. Characters, the writing, the pacing. There was like some horror, some comedy, twists. It ended on like a really cool cliffhanger to set up the second season. It was great. It kind of reminded me of like

4:26when I first started watching Stranger Things, whatever that was, 2012, 2013. I don't know. Like I couldn't wait for the next episode to see what happened next. And this was like that. It was a little 35-minute episode so they didn't drag too long. But yeah, I loved it. Yeah, it's on the queue. I've, I'm not the best with Apple TV on the weekly cadence. So I'm actually like still catching up with Silo and, oh my gosh, I had it.

5:00Silo and, dang, there was another one. Sci-fi. The follow-up to First Man on the Moon, that series that they did. Oh, Star City? Star City, yeah. Yeah, which is fun. Like my wife's Russian. Yeah, it's weird because it's so different from For All Mankind, just in tone and everything. It's a really slow like political intrigue drama. It's not about the space stuff really at all.

5:31It's all, it is about Star City. It's all about that. I can't get past that everybody has a British accent. Like I know they did that deliberately, but they're like, we don't want to make people work for it and stuff. But like, I don't know. This is like, so this being, marrying into a Russian household, this is actually like one of the biggest like sources of feedback. When it's like Russian speakers, like why are we speaking in British? And then I'm listening to them.

6:01I'm like, y'all speak British English, but like I get, I get this. So yeah, it's a fun one to watch. Even though sometimes my wife sighs when they say things in Russian. And I'm like, not everybody can get it. It's okay. We'll work on that. But yeah, like Ted Lasso, I think is coming out too. Yeah, Friday comes back. Tomorrow, yeah. Somewhat surprising, but very much not surprising. Fourth season, fifth season? I think it's fourth. Fourth season, yeah.

6:32Yeah. It's amazing that they made one NBC ad into a four season show, which is great. I know. I don't know if I care. It's an Olympics thing, right? Wasn't it for the Olympics? It was for the Olympics, yeah. Yeah. I think it was NBC. One of the sporting things. World Cup or Olympics? It aired during the Olympics, and then it was for NBC-owned, got the rights to the premiership. And so they were like, how do we get Americans into it? And that's how they came up with it. Yeah.

7:03Which was great. As a football and football fan, loved it. Perfect. I don't know if I care about season four. I'll see. I don't know. Jason, are you into it? What, Ted Lassa? Yeah, the fourth season. Do you care? Yeah, I do. I mean, I'm not like, oh my God, I can't wait. But I thought it was a great show. I thought it didn't overstay its welcome, which is what makes me worried about that they did another season after, was it three years or something?

7:33Like, they said, look, we told the story we wanted to tell. We're not going to, we don't want to start it up again unless we really have a good idea for where to take it from here. We don't want to just do it for the sake of doing it or because it's popular. And I was happy with that, but then they did it again. And having not seen it, I don't know that they stuck the landing, but I kind of feel like Apple just backed up a Brinks truck and just said to have all the money

8:05and they said, well, we'll come up with her. I always feel like the shows that do that, like when you look at something like Breaking Bad or The Sopranos or what, like they had a story to tell. They sold it in the allotted time that they had to tell it and they were done. Yeah. This one, like even by series three, season three, I was kind of like, all right, I'm done with this plot. Like, we'll see. Maybe I'm the outlier. No, season three notably kind of had some issues and like reading about it,

8:35they were like, the production was more of a mess. They were producing that season during COVID. Right. So that caused issues, but then also they were doing rewrites like the day before and everyone had to like get new scripts the day they were shooting. And so, you know, it was much more haphazard and all over the place and they kind of were figuring out the season's plot lines as they were shooting it. So it wasn't as well organized

9:06and fought out as the first couple seasons were. So I was just kind of, I didn't think it was bad, but I don't think it was as good as the first couple seasons. I was like, okay, cool. You're going to end it. So I'm just, I'm more curious than anything else. Like if there was never more Ted Lasso, I'd be fine. But I also enjoyed the show and if they managed to kind of bring back the magic, I'd be happy about that.

9:32Yeah. I mean, like the early seasons felt like they hit at the right time where they felt like chicken soup. Like it was really like heartwarming. Totally. It was that, yeah. Yeah. You know, do we need seven, five seasons of chicken soup is the question that I got. But yeah, I don't know. It will be interesting to see what they do with the characters and also how they articulate like international women's soccer, which I'm intrigued by. Right. And yeah, there should be some really fun comedy

10:02around that. But if it takes off, I'll have my Halloween costume all set because I was Ted Lasso a few years ago for Halloween. And it was good. You guys, I nailed it. So I'll, I still have all this stuff. I'll just, you could do that. And we need pictures if that, if that's the thing. This is news to me. I didn't know this happened. That could have been like a whole series of stories

10:32in galleries, Jason.

10:37Another show come, we'll wrap this segment up shortly, I promise. But does anyone watch Dark Matter? I think that's what it's called. I tried. I got like three episodes in and I thought the name of the show was a science thing. I didn't realize they didn't turn on lights in the show. That show is so dark. Like literally underlit dark. I couldn't tell. And that's okay if it's a horror show or something, but it's like a science thriller and they stand around in the kitchen

11:07like arguing in the dark a lot and stuff. And I was just like, all right, I'm just, I don't have the patience for this right now. There's a lot of show. We could do a whole podcast on like cinema lighting because it drives me crazy sometimes when I'm trying to see like, like we watched, I watched the movie Obsession recently and like that's supposed to be moody and dark, but it's like, I can't, I have no idea what's happening in half these scenes. I just have to kind of piece it together. I haven't seen dark matter yet.

11:41Mainly for the same reason because with a household of like two kids under 10, like most of my life is dominated by Bluey and or anime at this point. So like most nights when, and we don't have a TV, I have like a projector. So most nights I can't watch unless it's like 1145. And so during the day, like I'm like, I can't watch House of the Dragons. I can't watch any of these things because they are literally

12:13color corrected and graded in rooms that are perfectly theaters. That's interesting. Yeah. So yeah, I either need to get blackout curtains or, you know. Yeah. Or, you know, I mean, I know it's not as much fun, but you can, that's the nice thing about streaming, especially things like Apple TV and stuff is like, just watch it on your laptop. Like I know the laptop's lame, but it's like, if it's ketchup on my laptop or just never see it. That, yeah, that part. Yeah. Like most recently,

12:44and I know our, the next week's guest producer wants to talk about this, but like that is part of the reason that I'm like, maybe I'll get the iPhone ultra is to, to watch stuff. Um, but again, you know, is it worth the $2,000? That's for next week. That's a teaser. That was good. Roman, Roman, Roman throws it in every now and again. You're, you're fitting right in. I'm trying. Anyway, Apple TV, bunch of things coming up. Uh, Ted Lasso Friday,

13:15Dark Matter later this month. Um, Jason wrote a story yesterday about, uh, what, what, what's coming this month. Uh, it's, it's on a bit of a roll lately. Severance was a huge hit last year. Shrinking came back. Um, that new show, Widow's bag, it picked up a ton Oscar, uh, or Emmy nominations. Like, you know, they're doing good stuff. Oh, wait, before I, did anyone see the trailer for that matchbox movie? I did. Yeah. It's nonsense, right? Am I, am I crazy? Yes, it is. It's so, okay. Unless it's like,

13:45like this high concept that I don't understand. And maybe it'll reveal itself in the movie, but it seems like it's like insane. I, it, it seems like they, I, I can't, I don't know if they got the matchbox license after. And then just like write it into the script.

14:05Or if it's just like write a movie about matchbox cars, like we don't have fast and furious budget. So what are we going to do? Oh, we'll just make it about a group of kids who used to play matchbox cars and that's it. I don't know. It's not that it looks like a bad, dumb popcorn action movie. I just don't get the matchbox. That's what I'm saying. Other than the forced, like they play together as kids. we used to play cars and it's like, but all right, big freaking deal. So did I. Yeah.

14:35Yeah. I don't know. Anytime John Cena gives me hope. Like John Cena is a fun movie, dude. Sure. Yeah, exactly. All right. Like, is this going to be a laundry? Yeah, exactly. Like laundry movie. Am I going to fold laundry to it and be entertained? Perfect. Right. Yeah. Is it coming to theaters? Does anybody know? Or is it just, is it just. I don't. I don't think so. I think it would be straight to streaming, but I think it's straight to streaming. Let's see.

15:05Now, now I want to know. Yeah. Yeah. Apple TV on October 9th. So it's not in the theaters that, that that's, that's kind of tells you all you need to know.

15:15Yeah. Probably. Yeah. It's a straight to video action. Yeah. But it looks like, I mean, it had a high budget. I'm sure they had to pay something to get the matchbox name. I don't know. Anyway. All right. We, we've been on this for too long. Let's, let's switch gears to. I, I slack. Yeah. I don't know if you guys have your slacks. It's available. I select you a picture of myself as Ted Lasso from a few years back. We're going to put, can I put this in the, in the article on Thursday? Yeah. Sure. Hey, that's really good. Or edit it into the video.

15:46That doesn't look like you at all. That totally looks like Ted Lasso. This is an elite. Yeah. Yeah. 10 out of 10. Did you, did you make that jacket or did you buy it? No, I bought that. That's that, that and just a visor and a whistle, but like the, the jacket was the one thing I really had to buy. Then there's some athletic pants. It grew my hair out to like shave to the mustache and everything. It's good stuff. Love it. Five dollar aviators. If without the aviators, it doesn't work. Cause my head shape isn't like his, my eyes aren't like his.

16:17You've got to, you've got to go with the aviators thing. Oh yeah. With that, it totally worked. Yeah. No, like I said, I nailed it. I'm not kidding. Yeah. Ted Lasso coming back on a Friday and, and Jason's Halloween costume coming back in October.

16:34This episode is brought to you by Accenture. When your advertising operations fall out of sync, everything else follows. Spotify and Accenture are working together to reinvent the rhythm of ad sales using automation analytics and smarter workflows to simplify campaign delivery and access better data across the business. The result less time spent on operations, more time connecting brands with the moments and fandoms that matter most. Learn more at Accenture.com slash Spotify.

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Smart Home Products

17:35We've been writing about and reading about smart Apple. This, this big smart home push for, I don't know, Jason, like five years, maybe it's been a long time, maybe longer. The first articles, I think it feels like that, but I think the first articles I read about it was from 2000, 2024. And they were supposed to come with all the new, this new Apple intelligence thing, but what they ended up pitching as Apple intelligence. It just, Apple intelligence had problems.

18:07Yeah. From the start. From the start. And then, and they were like, well, we can't launch these products because Apple intelligence doesn't do what these products need to do. Right. And then the next year it still didn't. Yeah. Well, yeah. Last year they got a whole new architecture with all new things and they can finally launch all this stuff they've been. And the, the, the, the premier thing that we've been waiting for is Siri because Siri is the thing that is the brains behind this whole operation and it's good. Um, we've been, uh,

18:38Jason and I've been testing, um, iOS 27 and you know, it it's, it's legitimately good. It gets to a place where it doesn't feel like it's years behind anymore. Right. And there's some stuff that kind of Siri relies upon that will be critical for these products in particular, like advancements in what, what Apple, uh, brands as visual intelligence, like that's going to be critical for half of these products. Right. Right. And so, yeah, most of them have a screen.

19:08Well, we'll start with the simple ones first, where this fall allegedly the new Apple TV 4k and the new home pod mini, both of which are many, many years old at this point. Yeah. Um, a home pod mini never got an update. It got, it got a new color. It got colors, right? Yeah. But it never got like a proper update since it was introduced in, I think 2020 and Apple TV 4k has, has been around for several years with its same processor.

19:39And when Apple introduced TV OS and iOS 27, home pod and Apple TV were basically left out. Like they didn't get anything as far as the new series stuff, the Apple intelligence stuff. Yeah. Not any of this cool series stuff. Right. They, there's, there's some app, there's some Apple TV updates that don't have anything to do with. Right. Siri. Right. But the, the smart home stuff that all the other things are getting or the smart stuff rather than that smart. Yeah. So much like it's not going to end.

20:09So it leads us to believe that the new products, the new home pod mini, we haven't heard anything about a new home pod. So I guess, yeah, I don't know if they'll ever make another home pod again. Like a home pod home pod. We got that random, the two years ago, three years ago, we got a second edition, second generation out of the blue in like February. Right. That was basically the same thing with some tweaks and a new chip. And that's it. Like it hasn't, they, they raised the price last month, but they haven't released anything new for the larger home pod.

20:42But all the reports that we read say that the home pod mini, specifically the mini will be getting an update, which now costs $129. It was 99 forever. And Apple just raised the price to $129 back when it had its big price thing in the end of June. So I think both for all of these, so for Apple TV and home pod, they can serve as what they call home hubs for you. And which you need to have to do things like certain,

21:12certain smart home stuff with Apple requires a quote home hub, which used to, I don't mean, I think they turned off this feature. It used, used to be able to have an iPad that was plugged in and it could be your home hub. They did. They turned that off. But so now it's got to be like an Apple TV or a home pod. Can you explain really quick what you can't do if you don't have a home pod? I forget them all off the top of my head. I know for certain the video stuff,

21:46all the, all those home, like home, home kit, secure video stuff, you know, where you can watch the video in the home app on your iPhone and it's all encrypted and all that. I know all of that stuff requires a home hub and I, and any of the stuff where you do automations, where you can leave the house and do them from somewhere else out on the internet requires a home hub because the home hubs like your gateway to the internet for all of your internal smart home stuff. Some of that stuff works when you're home on your same local network as all your smart appliances are.

22:18But in order to control any of your smart appliances from outside your home network, you need a home hub. And there's some specific features. I don't remember what the whole list of them is, but it's not something you have to set up specifically. If you just have any of those products kind of on your home network, you're good. Like it just does it. Right. But the chip in the Apple, the current best Apple TV and the HomePod mini just aren't, they don't support the new Siri like in any way.

22:51They're not, they're far behind what the, like the Apple watch cutoff point for Siri AI. Series nine. Yeah. Is series nine. And what's, what is that? Series seven or something. It's a seven. And the same thing with the chip in the Apple TV, which is an A series chip. They're just, they're just behind those things. And I think they need them. Oh, the HomePod mini is actually an S5 chip. So that's way behind. Oh, that's way behind. Yeah.

23:23So even though they won't be doing all the things your iPhone does, like they're, they don't have cameras and do visual intelligence and all that stuff. They still need to run that thing that goes like, okay, what are they asking? What are the words that they're saying mean? Do I do this here? Does it go up to the cloud? What information do they need to send to the cloud? What if it needs to be processed there like running all of that, that system architect part? Like, I just don't think any of the current products can do that. They need new products that do. We haven't heard though,

23:54that this new HomePod mini and this new Apple TV will have any special new Siri features. No. Other than new Siri will work, but like they're not going to. At WWDC, Apple didn't mention any of that. So. Right. We assume this stuff will come out at or around the time of the iPhone event at or around the time all the OS 27 updates come out and Apple will say, here's the new Open mini, here's the new Apple TV 4k. And it also enables Siri AI and here's the app and all that stuff.

24:25We don't know that for sure though. Oddly enough, the reports just say it's coming. It hasn't really just like detailed what you'll be able to do. Will you be able to have those conversational stuff with, with the new Siri? Will it have the, the, you know, be able to plug into your apps like the, like, well, I guess that would only be for Apple TV, but like, like I assume there'll be certain things that can and can't do, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. So like, we don't know. We're just assuming that the new mini will be like,

24:56you'll be able to have a conversation with it just like you would your phone, but. Or your Apple watch, right? Like Siri would on your Apple watch, right? A new Siri AI empowered Apple watch. Right. And I think probably you're, you're not going to get anything special out of the new Apple TV in terms of Siri AI other than it works with the new Siri AI and maybe there'll be the Siri app so you can see your list of previous conversations. It would be cool if you could say like,

25:26Hey, what like you're watching the show and he'd say, um, what, what else is this actress in? And it knows what's on your screen, looks it up and tells you like, it could do stuff like that. Theoretically. I think, God, there's a certain amount of that already in there, but I'm trying to remember. Yeah. That it's, it's not actually, actually is the Amazon stuff insights or something it's called. Well, there's insight. That's like an onscreen visual thing, but no, there's, I mean, Siri literally press and hold the Siri, button. You can ask it some, some things like that,

25:57that work on Apple TV. I don't know where the limits are. It could be smarter. I think most of this is setting things up for like next TV OS 28. We'll have all this cool Siri stuff that you do on your TV.

26:12Yeah. And you know, you're probably going to need one of these two new hardware devices to use all that stuff. There's a lot of Apple TVs out there. They're not going to be obsolete, but they're going to be a little bit outdated because you know, this stuff isn't going to work. And now Apple, assuming the prices stay the same, 199 bucks, you know, all of a sudden Apple TV is pretty expensive. If you have to update one that you've had for a couple of years, like I have, I bought the 4k back when they Apple cut the price I got,

26:44cause it was, you know, it was cheaper and I had an older one. I'm like, Oh yeah, cool for 200 bucks. I don't know if I would, maybe we'll see.

26:54Um, so that's this probably the fall.

HomePad Rumors

26:58Now,

HomePad Rumors

26:59the other thing that may or may not come this fall that we've been hearing about forever is what we in the media have dubbed home pad, which is supposed to be like a smart home hub. It's nothing new. Amazon has one. Google has one. They're, they're out there, but Apple doesn't. Right. It's like an echo show or what does Google call theirs now? Nest, Nest hub or something. Yeah. Or maybe not Nest. I don't even know anymore. Oh, speaking of Nest, can I, can I, can I, can I speak in a hard smart home stuff?

27:28So I have, I have a bunch of, I have a bunch of Nest protects in my house. Okay. Right. The, the smoke detector. Right. So I didn't, unbeknownst to me, they have a expiration date. Yeah. All smoke detector. Of 10 years. But this one is actually like, it, it yells at me every single day that it's going to expire. I've had it for 10 years. Oh. So it says the Nest protect in the kitchen will expire. Please replace it. So I'm like, okay, fine. So I go to, they don't make them anymore.

27:59No, they don't make them. So now I'm totally, I got to figure out. Regular smoke detector. Right. Four of them are Google and they all talk to each other. The one that is supposed to replace the protect is, is by, um, uh, first, first response. Yeah. But the reviews of that are God awful. So now I don't know what to do. So now I'm going to eBay to try to find one that people are selling. Well, I could do that, but I don't want to do that. Jason. I feel like this is going to be the issue that like,

28:32as Apple gets into the more, like, here's the home hub situation is like, as a fortunate homeowner, like, I'm like, I don't know. Sometimes I'm trying to figure out where the line of like, where my entry point for smart devices is. Right. Like I tried the smart lights. Um, and when those die, there's a specific kind that like my daughter, she calls them the rave lights because they'll just start flickering. Oh boy. Um, versus,

29:03all right, do I get in and have the touch point B the switch and change the switches out? And then especially with like matter and finally like meta or, um, finally with Apple and all the others, home kit and like matter being integrated. I think like that's a nice step, but it is one of those things of like, okay, you're entering this potentially entering this market. What, how are,

29:34how is Apple going to like really, really step this forward where people are like, okay, I need to use it. Um, which is my thing with the home pad. I'm always so curious on how that's going to work. price is number one. And yeah, they can't be, there'll be an Apple free, but it can't be $600. And with the recent price hikes, I don't know anymore. Like I saw a 299 was a slam dunk. Yeah. Okay. Good idea. First, because it was catching up on the rumors. It's supposed to be a,

30:05it is a new device category. It is not just like a, a, an iPad and it is got a new operating system that borrows elements from Apple TV and from, um, watch OS. Like it's going to have essentially complications and stuff. Uh, and the form factor is unique. It's got a seven inch, pretty much square ish screen. And so that's like, that's like this big, you know, that's not huge. And square is a weird form factor for Apple. I mean, it's probably not a perfect square,

30:35but squarish, right? Yeah. And there are supposed to be kind of two versions of it. One that you snapped magnetically down onto a, a dome shaped dock, almost like a half a HomePod, like a small speaker based dock. And another that's meant to be mounted onto a wall. You put a little frame on the wall and you can snap it up onto the wall and take it off. Um, Lord knows how long the battery life is for the one you have on the wall. Like it's got to be one of those things I run a cord down to like smart lights or like,

31:06I don't know. Um, and it's supposed to be, uh, people, people have said in the past, the rumors that it's not going to have a, um, an app store of its own. Right. It's, it's going to be treated like an, uh, like an accessory. Like the home app of sorts where you add accessories through whatever interface. Yeah. You'll add accessories, but it'll also have other things. It'll have Apple music and it'll have FaceTime and it'll have a camera for FaceTime.

31:40It'll have, it'll have widgets and complications on the home screen that you can adjust. The part of the magic of the thing, the smart thing, the thing that's supposed to be so special about it is that the camera will be able to recognize distinct people. One of the challenges Apple has with smart home stuff is that it builds a lot of single user devices and things that live in your home get used by a bunch of people.

32:07So that's always been tough for Apple. Uh, they can kind of recognize voices on HomePod stuff, but like this is, the idea with this is that if it sees I'm looking at it, it will show me my home screen. And then if it saw my wife was looking at it, it would show her her preferred home screen, right? The way she has it set up and use her preferences and settings. And it would also be able to recognize how close you are and sort of like enlarger or make smaller like things like text, depending on if you're far away and everything.

32:38Like doing all those things seamlessly and automatically is supposed to be the magic part of this. But other than that, it does the things that the Nest Home Hubs and everything else does. It has like a dashboard to control your thermostats and your lights and everything. And it shows your photos and it does, you know, all the other smart home hub stuff that the other guys do, but just in an Apple way. Okay. The most recent report from last week said that Apple expects people to buy multiple of these things and kind of put them around the house.

33:08So that kind of led to you to think that it won't be too expensive. But again, with the RAM issues is going to have to have, you know, six or eight gigs of RAM. Who the hell knows, you know? Yeah. Who knows? Yeah.

33:23It sounds like a really cool device. If it's, it has like a home, like a really good speaker and can detach places. Like that's cool. I, that's something that like Amazon, I have a echo. Everyone does. They gave them out basically a couple of years ago. You know, I have a, I've, I've used the Google stuff and they're all, they're fine, but you have to walk over to them and be very deliberate with what you want to do. And if this is what Jason's talking about, where it recognizes you,

33:54it changes and morphs. Like, that's like the dream of like those movies where you walk into a rich person's house and you walk in and everything kind of adjusts to what you're doing. Like that's, that's super cool. If, if that's what Apple is going to pull off here. Yeah, I think it's, I think it's going to baby steps. It's going to start with just, Hey, if, if you're looking at it, it's your home screen and your preferred settings. And it's just going to like, when you tell it to play something, it plays it from your playlist and not somebody else's.

34:24They're going to have, I think Apple's probably thought this through, but like a lot of privacy stuff, making sure that just some random person in your house can access your calendar and your notes, but, but can interact with it, can ask Siri a thing, you know? It kind of, HomePod kind of does that now. Yeah, they kind of do that. Yeah. They have a thing now where. It's not perfect, but it, but it like recognizes your voice and it'd be like, Oh, I'm sorry. You're not Lynn. You can't ask her. It's too good right now because my, it has for no good reason.

34:56It's about 50, 50. It just can't recognize my wife's voice. It goes, that's not good. Like you don't want it. Yeah. They're like, all the time. So hopefully it gets better when they have a camera to go with it. Yeah. But this is a cool new device and it could launch as early as late this year, but everyone kind of expects it to be a spring next year situation. Yeah.

35:23And that's like the centerpiece of this whole thing that Apple is doing. Right. Including the Apple TV and the, and the, and the HomePod mini. And there's also rumors of a doorbell with face ID that I guess would work in a similar way as to what Jason was describing. That seems like a massive security problem. Like if I'm getting robbed or if someone's like following me to my house, I don't want my door to automatically open just by recognizing me. I don't know. I'm sure Apple will think of some way to,

35:54to stop that. But you know, there are instances where you don't want your door to open automatically. It's rare. Just because it sees you. Yeah. Right. I don't think most of the time it would be very helpful. Most of the time it would be very helpful. If I was being chased, saving a few seconds getting into my house would be good. There's that. That's true.

36:16But I'm sure you could just turn that feature off. Well, the last rumor I read was saying that Apple's not necessarily going to do a doorbell. It was going to build a ecosystem that works like, kind of like rings does where the doorbell works with other cameras and stuff like that. And the OS 27 updates have the first step of that, where if your cameras support your home security cameras and stuff, support HomeKit secure video,

36:47number one, they improve the resolution, which they really needed to do. But second, they can stitch together a person or an event from multiple cameras into a single timeline where you can follow them around. And it does the AI analysis on there where it describes what they're doing or what happened. You know, this is kind of whatever all the smart home cameras people are doing and stuff. So even if they don't release a doorbell first, it would like work with whatever they release, work with a doorbell in that way. They're supposed to be doing like an inside home security camera,

37:21maybe as their first standalone camera E thing, you know, have you, you, you, you don't have a, do you have a home home kit, secure video and compatible camera? We bought a bunch of rings. Oh, you do have one. Yeah. So I got the like Bilkin one from the Apple store and then I'm such. So my, my whole stance of like why I wanted to test it out was,

37:51is that like Apple's whole thing of security, right. And like privacy. And I thought that that was super useful. Just from like past experiences of like learning what ring does with things. Like I respect it, but I'm also like, I kind of want to be a little bit more in control of it. So the setup I had at home was the Bilkin doorbell, which was super easy to install and like totally a breeze. And then abode the home,

38:22like for the home kit security system, which was mostly to watch my dogs because they low key tear stuff up.

38:32So, so I was just like, I need to know what mess I'm walking into before I like clean up for the kids and the wife.

38:40And then, yeah, like overall it worked pretty well. I think my main issue was, is when things either got discontinued or Apple didn't support another system into it, which I know was a hard thing for like some people to get like certification for home kit. Um, right. So, and then also moving like switching homes and stuff. That was a whole process. Um, but yeah, like I see the potential with Apple home kit.

39:12I'm really excited for the seven inch device, especially for like the FaceTime component of being able to like FaceTime on screen where my kids can like talk with grandma and grandpa in Portland. Like that would be great. Um, and then, yeah, I, I'm intrigued to see how flexible the system is in this design of like, what are, if people do have to switch homes, like how does this system move with them, especially with such a heavy investment?

39:42Um, that's going to be another question for the long tail. Almost all this smart home stuff, especially when it comes to cameras and security is a pain. If you move like you, they all have some process, but it's a pain in the butt process to like detach it from your location and move it to a new location. You would think it would just be like, I just set it up in your new house. But like, no, it's still thinks it's in another location and all that. Uh, um, I got a bunch of ring stuff when we got our house before Amazon bought them.

40:13So I have ring doorbells and I have internal cameras and I have external cameras with the floodlights and all that stuff. So for me to kind of dip my toe into Apple's secure home view video, it is going to be a nightmare because I'm going to have to live in two apps that have separate features and don't work together. And, uh, so I, I would love to do any of this stuff, but it kind of means replacing everything. Nobody's got a good alarm system for me to replace with,

40:44but I'd be okay with just the alarm system being that, um, I have, um, simply safe. Yeah. Which is in home kit. Also, it's a, it's a pain. It's such a pain. So I had ADT and then they got, they just got way too expensive for their monthly monitoring. So I, I switched to home, uh, simply safe, which is, you know, I haven't tested it. I haven't had, I haven't recently tested it. Yeah. Yeah. It's pretty cheap. It's like 20 or $30. Um, but their, their equipment is very good. But like Jason says,

41:15if I have to replace everything with Apple, and I think there's a lot of people in this same boat and especially if, so I have certain things that I, that I have, I have an outdoor flood camera, like you just said, but it's wired. I have a wired doorbell. I have a battery, um, uh, uh, camera on the side of my house. So like, there are things that I would need Apple to release. And it doesn't sound like they're going to come out with enough to replace all the things. Oh. And so either like you said, you live in two apps or you just say,

41:46forget it. Let, I'll just wait. Either Apple or there's good stuff that supports the Apple ecosystem. Yeah. But it's all the same app. I'm fine with it being a different brand, but what am I going to do about my outdoor camera floodlights? Like I use those a lot. And I kind of enjoy that these things work together. So like we have a few, we have a handful, a couple of internal cameras. They're off all the time. And unless we turn the alarm on. Yeah. Yeah. When we turn the alarm on into our,

42:17we're away, there's two, there's a home out armed and an away and armed mode, but like in the away, what's your, then they run. What's your alarm? Is that, is that the ring? We have all rings. Yeah. The ring things that you buy and stick up around and a doorbell and all those other things. And they, they just work together. So to replace just one of them, all of a sudden you're breaking that. Yeah. Well, if I get Apple cameras inside, then they don't turn on when my alarm turns on. So then I can set them with a separate automation to say,

42:51Hey, when everyone has left the house, turn on these cameras. But that's like a separate thing. I've got to set up. Or like this glass break sensor and that door sensor where like it's, it's important. And that's why Apple coming in so late to this game is it puts them at a severe disadvantage for people who have already established a smart home of sorts. Yeah. This episode is brought to you by Accenture. When you're advertising operations fall out of sync,

43:21everything else follows. Spotify and Accenture are working together to reinvent the rhythm of ad sales, using automation, analytics, and smarter workflows to simplify campaign delivery and access better data across the business. The result, less time spent on operations, more time connecting brands with the moments and fandoms that matter most. Learn more at Accenture.com slash Spotify.

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Siri AI Updates

44:15So it's going to be interesting to see where they go with this, how they go with it. And, you know, first of all, how much this stuff costs, because doorbells are, you know, one to $200.

44:28Cameras are, you know, $150 to $250, give or take. If they come out with a $400 camera, I don't know. I can't imagine many people. Can't imagine. Yeah. The doorbell is, Brennan, you were asking like the, where do you dip your toe into a smart home? The doorbell is like the easiest, best place to do it. Just make sure that if you don't like how Ring operates or how this company operates, just make sure that you look up like, how do they operate? But the simple,

45:00I get a notification on my phone when someone rings my doorbell and a picture of them. Right. And it's a camera that faces out of your door, which is like not a place you're really concerned about privacy, you know, and stuff. Like that's the kind of the simplest. And around my neighborhood, like everyone has some kind of camera doorbell. And it was like the simplest help ask was, it's like, if you're out and somebody is delivering something, you can just talk to them with that. Right. So that's, yeah, that's been super helpful.

45:30I think with the spring lineup or the rumored lineup of the announcement of it being in spring, that just feels like a WWDC, like, Hey, here's an ecosystem move. Right. That like could be an opportunity to be able to say, Hey, we recognize y'all might already have these pieces. This is our stance on like how we work on the Alliance. But like, I don't know if that will actually happen. Yeah. I don't think, I think they're beyond Alliance. Part of the problem is that the biggest prop ring is probably the biggest name

46:04in these. Yeah. But there's some, there's some, and it's owned by Amazon. So they're never good. Yeah. But they, they've, they've faced some criticisms in recent years with them working with the police and scanning faces and saving stuff. So like, that's not a slam dunk. There's, it's, it's so scattered right now. Like there's echo B is really good. And, and you fi is good or however you pronounce it. Simply safe is good. I'm like, they all basically do the same thing, but you got to pick. And once you get locked into one, even if you're not locked in,

46:35you kind of feel like you are. Yeah. And it also shifts the shopping experience. Cause a lot of this stuff is like Lowe's and home Depot. And like, sure. Yes. That experience of being like sitting and what, looking at the smart home sections and seeing how people are like, does this work with all my things? That's going to be an interesting market to try and penetrate for them. But I really, I'm loving the matter situation, but they just need to get faster.

47:06Like there's no matter for like home alarm yet. And it's on the list of like, yeah, we're going to get to that. It's like, okay, but I don't need my Roomba to support matter. It's nice. But I think the home alarm like should have been from the first, they have locks and doors and lights and things like blinds, pretty much anything that goes on or off. And, and, but the things that have a lot of other states and do things with those states, they're just not there yet with the matter stuff. That's really the solution for all this.

47:37Like once it all supports matter, you're done. You just buy a brand that supports matter. It's all going to work in your home app. It's all going to work together. Or if you feel like jumping to the Google app or something like that, it's all going to work in that. Like everyone's on board with matter. Yeah, but it wasn't, they weren't forever. So I have some of my plugs are matter and some of them aren't. Oh yeah. Yeah, no. Yep. All right. So all this stuff is coming sometime between September and probably next

48:08June. I would think the home pad will be first. Well, maybe not. Maybe the, no, I think the home, the home pod mini and Apple TV updates will be, because those are chip and ship updates. They don't, they're not going to look different. I can see that popping up early in the iPhone event, just to kind of get things rolling. Then they do the iPhone 18 and then they do the ultra or something like that. I kind of feel like they're not even going to talk about it. And they're just going to be press releases. Well, but if there's like a whole bunch of features that go with it.

48:39Right. Right. Yeah. I guess what I'm saying is I expect zero new features. Oh, I, I, I, it's just going to support the new series. That'll be a disappointment. That'll be it. Right. Like, so nothing other than what we know, maybe. Yeah. Like whatever you do with Siri now, like the, the new Siri AI, like you'll be able to, they'll support the new Siri AI. You'll be able to talk to it conversationally and stuff like that. And that'll be it. That's why they'll just do a press release thing. And then like next year at WWDC for the 28 releases, there'll be a TV OS 28.

49:11We'll have all these cool AI features and, Oh, you know, the fine print will be, you need the new, the one we released last fall, you know, that's how I think it's going to go. I think there's, I don't think that there's massive new AI features for any of these for, for those two, for just the, the home pad will have all kinds of cool stuff. It's a new interface and there's a lot for them to talk about with that. But I think the, uh, home pod mini and the Apple TV are there chip and ship updates and they'll just with the addition of Siri AI.

49:43Yeah. So slightly, slightly more. Well, we'll see. Um, so yeah, maybe September, maybe October, maybe March, maybe June. We don't know, but sometime soon.

Apple's Trillion Dollar Milestone

49:57All right.

Apple's Trillion Dollar Milestone

49:58Um, all right, Brandon, usually Roman does this week in Apple history, but, um, I'm prepared to, to take it over if you don't want to. All right. Or you're not ready to, or you haven't prepared to, because I don't think I told you that. I, we, we talked about it. I mean, I can, I can tap in with anecdotal talks about it. Yeah. Let's, let's do that. All right. I will. Um, okay. So, uh, I don't even know what,

50:28what, wait, wait, wait, wait, what year is this? Damn it, Roman, come back from Iceland. Um, in 2018, uh, August, um, 2nd, 2018. So a couple of days ago, it's August 4th right now when we're recording this, Apple became the world's first trillion dollar company, the world's first, like no one had ever done it before. Um, it was a big deal. That was only eight years ago. That is crazy. Cause the other day it briefly passed 5 trillion.

50:58Let me see where it's at now. Cause they got clobbered after their earnings last week. Right now it is at four and a half trillion. So they lost about half a trillion. That's, that's wild. And they weren't the first to break five. NVIDIA did it before. They were not. They dipped down too. So they've both breached five and gone back down a little bit, but to go up 500 X, I mean, 500% in, uh, like eight years. Yeah. Almost exactly. Eight years. Yeah. Um,

51:29and I find that what I find, I guess, most interesting about that is it's kind of been the worst eight years. Like it's been, it's been the quietest eight years. That's for sure. Right. Like vision pro flopped. Yeah. Uh, they're way, the last three years have been, the narrative has just been like how far behind on AI.

51:51Apple is. And so people been buying iPhones, like the only real good news in terms of like a new product that was actually not just like a faster version of last year's product and did something and was new and cool was MacBook Neo. MacBook Neo was like a major huge, and that was just this year. And then they raised the price. I was supposed to show you that. What's that? And then they raised the price a couple of weeks. Well, they raised the price, but all the other laptops in the world got more expensive. It's still relative to the market. Like it's a cheap laptop.

52:22It's for the first time, it's doing great. But it's, I just find it interesting that they became a trillion dollar company and they kept, kept it rolling so well, even though they really didn't like there, there's no groundbreaking new thing. It's just like the momentum is so strong. Yeah. Even like AirPods, they came out in 2016. That was before that helped them get to one trillion. I mean, part of it is the insanity. That is the stock market these days.

52:52Everything is very overvalued, particularly tech stocks. Yeah. Like I was just reading about this where their PE multiple, they're actually, they got hit based off of their earnings, but their PE multiples actually more reason is being rewarded. For not going into AI as much like, yeah, which is interesting, especially with this new CEO, like stepping in and being a hardware specific person. I think that might be the opportunity for them to grow even more as a brand,

53:24because it's like Apple right now. It's the hardware just really works for a lot of people really, really well. Yeah. And then also they have a pretty solid service industry. Like Tim Cook built out the services amongst a lot of the flops. And I think that was a pretty big winner of like locking people into the ecosystem really well. And they're going to, they've got this, you know, the upgrade program, a lot of this stuff that's coming up, that's expensive, that may not hurt them so much because it's,

53:57it's a way in for people. So yeah, we'll see. It's going to be interesting to watch as well, but they're, yeah, they're just not as over-invested in AI as a lot of these companies are. Yeah. Where they're just spending hundreds of billions and not getting anything out of it. Like that, like I hear CapEx, capital expenditure on AI from companies are, is astronomical. Apple is obviously spending on it, but not in a way that Amazon spending 40% of its budgets on AI.

54:28That's right. You know, like Apple's just like, yeah, we're investing in it, but no more than we would have normally. I mean, actually they are, well, they are saying they're, Tim Cook will be the first to tell you, no, no, we're investing in it more heavily than ever or anything, but it's nothing like these guys doing a hundred billion a year and not getting any of it back. Like it's just not.

54:49I know. That's cool. Yeah. I'm so intrigued, like from a stock that was at like what in 85, it was 25 cents or something. In like 2000, it was like five bucks and yeah, we're basically done. It's, it's an interesting situation to see like, all right, you made it to a trillion and now you're in the fours and potentially in the fives. But like, how do you do that? Is it expanding your 20% market share of phone and mobile devices? And like,

55:20you can't, depending on what they do for their announcement this year, right? Like dropping a $2,000 phone, upping your price on your main phones, like how does that actually get most the rest of the world on board? Right? Like how do you saturate more of the market outside of being like, yeah, Macbook Neo was kind of their first, I mean, boy, did that, did that make Microsoft sweat? Right? Because they're, they were used to this idea that like,

55:51uh, yeah, people like their Macs, but like everybody buys a sub $1,000 notebook. That's 80% of the market and Apple's just not even there and we don't even care. And it doesn't matter if window it's amazing to me how desperate they are to fix windows now. Like every other blog post from Microsoft is about how they're optimizing windows and making it run fast and getting rid of all the cruft and doing all these things. And they were not interested in doing that when it was, when they had a capture on the market,

56:22then Neo comes out and they're like, crap. Yeah. The, the Ram crisis has really affected Apple's ability. Like they were like, you can see the signs, the iPhone 17 E and the Mac Bonilla came out within days of each other. And like they were, you know, the iPhone 17 E, you can, you can criticize it. You can criticize Neo as well, but it doesn't matter. There were $600 devices that got a $1,200 device into the hands of someone who couldn't afford it.

56:52And that, yep. Yeah. I think that like the E cycle and that Neo cycle is going to be the thing that, that is going to dictate it. Like even the, I tear it, I fix it tear down of the Neo too, right? Like, Oh, Hey, this is one of the more repairable computers that we've come out with. Yeah. I think that's, that's the other step where it's like, how do you expand that to the top of your market line? And then also down below, because again,

57:23the stuff's getting more expensive, the components are getting more expensive. People are also, their products last mad long, right? Like, yeah. Like I don't need to upgrade my Apple watch and Jason, you've heard me yap about this, but if it wasn't, if it wasn't for the fact that like, I'm running, trying to run an ultra marathon, like that's the only reason I'm trying to switch my watch and also Siri, but like, it's, yeah, I'm so intrigued to see what under new stewardship,

57:54this like Apple's going to do to like grow more. Yeah.

58:01It's the, the tactic you were talking about before, get more money out of the existing people. Like that's a tactic, but it's not, it's not growing them into new markets where the, that, that come in at the bottom end of the price stack. So we'll see what happens with that. It'll be the, the whole Apple upgrade thing is very interesting because it's US only and all that stuff right now. That's just a way to get kind of people into more expensive stuff. If it'll be interesting to see if they're able to expand this into markets like India and stuff like that,

58:33where there's a growth of this big growth of people into this, the, the market segment that just edges up to where Apple starts. Right. There's a lot of people with like two and $300 phones in India. They're just not quite at where they, but, but could they afford to pay a monthly payment to Apple for like an E class phone? Maybe like, so maybe that, that this is all part of how they kind of grow this ecosystem. Cause it's incredibly sticky both by design and just because it's good.

59:06Both of these things are true. And it's like, well, cause like once you're in people don't leave. Yeah. And there's nothing capable, comparable from Google or Samsung or anyone that makes the, this array of products and services that people a enjoy and be like, you're locked in, but you don't feel locked in because like, I enjoy it. I like my iPhone. I like Apple music. It's the wall. The garden is nice. Right. Sure. It's got a wall, but it's nice. It's fine.

59:36Way to leave it anyway. Right. It's like that last avatar or the avatar last airbender line of like, there is no war in bossing say, like sometimes it's like when you hit a certain limitation and you're like, okay, I start looking, but then other times I'm like, wait, my father is going to share photos on iCloud and I cannot instruct him on how to do this thing. Right. Or, um, it's little, little elements like that, that I'm just like, all right, my brain,

1:00:07it's worth the Apple tax on that. Right. And the support for, I mean, iOS 27 goes back to the iPhone, what, 13, 12. I mean, no one's doing that either. So, um, yeah, we'll see. But 1 trillion, eight years ago in eight years, will they be worth 10 trillion Jason? Probably. Will they five X again? I don't see why not. Could they be going to be the first 25 trillion?

1:00:33I mean, there's a lot on the horizon glasses, folding phone, uh, touchscreen MacBook. And that's just in the next couple of years. So there's a lot. And, you know, we'll see what Ternus does and starting in September. Yeah. We should have a whole show. Oh, it's planned. Just about Ternus. I have it written down. August 31st or 30th, whatever it is, right before Tim Cook leaves. It'll all be about Tim Cook's tenure, which was a good one. Yeah. We should get photos of, uh, his, his go-kart collection. Like that's the main thing I knew about him before.

1:01:04Oh, really? I don't, I don't think I knew that. Yeah. The dude is like, he tinkers with go-karts and builds them. That's one of those big things. Yeah. All right. He's got enough money to do it. I love that for him.

1:01:22This episode is brought to you by Accenture. When your advertising operations fall out of sync, everything else follows. Spotify and Accenture are working together to reinvent the rhythm of ad sales, using automation, analytics, and smarter workflows to simplify campaign delivery and access better data across the business. The result, less time spent on operations, more time connecting brands with the moments and fandoms that matter most. Learn more at Accenture.com slash Spotify. When you need to build up your team to handle the growing chaos at work,

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Comment Section

1:02:22Jason. Yes. Do you have any comments? Did you dig up any comments while we were talking? All right, good. Let me go back to the, so on TikTok, we were talking about the touchscreen MacBook Pro. On a comment from a podcast clip when we were talking about, would you,

1:02:46do you care about a touchscreen MacBook? Do you want one? Okay. So we had a few comments on that, you know, at peace at last said, it's for young people, not for us old fogies.

1:02:58Yeah. Yep. And Fajito Bonito says, how about a touchscreen iMac, which I think we talked about before how they'd have to change the iMac, but that Microsoft Surface that went down like a drafting table would be the thing. Like that would be the way to go. They're never going to do that, but that would be sweet. No, that would be really sweet. Yeah. So back to the touchscreen MacBook for old people or young people. I mean, sure. My, my biggest question mark with the, with the touchscreen MacBook Pro,

1:03:28that's supposed to come out a couple of months. It, it appears to be geared towards pros, like high end pros. Like it's going to start expensive. It might be MacBook ultra, right? It's going to be, I don't know if those people care about touchscreen. Right. Like on a film perspective, on a film set, there's only like two people that I would think of that would use that really. And it's like a digitech or a DIT on a film set. Right. But I don't know if it's,

1:04:00they already have so many different touch interfaces to work with. Right. That touchscreen is not going to be the first one. It seems like it's geared at the wrong market. Like my son is in high school. He would want one. I'm not buying them at $3,000 a laptop. There's, there's one pro market that I feel like it is laser focused at. Not so much. You'd make a whole product around it. And that is app developers, right? Like you can pull up your iPhone SIM on the screen and you can actually tap and use it like an iPhone. Okay. That makes total sense to me.

1:04:32But like, all right, all these app developers are going to buy a MacBook Pro that starts at $3,000. You need a MacBook to develop iPhone apps. That is unfortunately like a critical thing. Xcode is, right. Yeah. Is it on iPad now? Xcode? It's not still, right? It's not still. And you can't publish to the app store without, except through the tools that are only on the Mac and stuff. So, so there's that. There's the like, yeah, I can SIM my iPhone and actually touch and swipe and do iPhone stuff.

1:05:04But that, is that it? So I don't do cool things, but like you said, like for that, for the price tag, like it, we always said, shouldn't the air be the first? Right. Or the Neo. I imagine the Neo with a touchscreen for 700 bucks. Like, geez, they would have, they would have sold a million. Every kid. Every kid. 30 billion. Yeah. Yeah. And going back to that comment, it is the perfect thing. Like a Neo with my daughter, she would not ask questions about like her computer. Right. Like she's just like, all right.

1:05:35Kids are already touching the screen. Cause they assume it's a touchscreen. Exactly. And then like I was listening, as I was listening to y'all's podcast last week, it was one of the things that came up was the ad for like the iPad pro, I think when it was the girl running around New York, right? Like with the iPad and being like, the neighbor says, is this a computer? Right. Like that moment. I'm like, all right, cool. That's dope. But why are we doing that at the top line outside of like the cost? Right.

1:06:05Yeah, exactly. Um, but yeah, also a three 60 swivel. Like if it was like a one 80 swivel, this is one of my gripes right now with some of the touchscreen laptops. I don't need a one 80 swivel. I want a three 60 swivel. I don't think it's a swivel at all. Like lay flat. You mean? Yeah. Yeah. And then like, if it doesn't swivel at all, it's going to be like bend gate all over again, where somebody opens it out of the box and then tries to swivel it. And then it cracks. And they're like, I just broke my $4,000 or $5,000 laptop.

1:06:37Yeah. We don't know if it's, if it's a convertible type thing yet. Yeah. From what we've heard, it's not going to have like a separate kind of touch interface. It's going to be Mac OS's regular interface. It's just going to react when you touch it by making things bigger and stuff. So, so maybe it won't inspire people to swivel it, you know, I don't know. All right. We got another comment. This one on the video about, I posted about the iPhone upgrade program.

1:07:11I mean, the Apple upgrade program asking if you would lease your iPhone or Mac.

1:07:18Yeah. Yeah. Mobius 03692 says in a word, hell no. That's two words, Mobius. That's two words. Dr. Frankintosh says, yes, yes, yes. I've been rolling my own lease program for years now. I buy a refurbished Mac, use it for one or two years, resell it for 50% of the original purchase price and purchase another referral for, I think you meant refurb for 15% off saving $65. So you just mathing it all out. That is okay. I appreciate the enthusiasm,

1:07:49but that is not a lease. You're buying and selling. Right. Which is cool. And I've gone you, but I have financed my iPhone for, for years through either. Well, it was first to the iPhone upgrade program. And then I just did it through the Apple card. It's essentially the same thing. I know what you're saying. It's so it's a lease and it's different. Those are essentially the same. Zero percent financing, but you're paying the purchase price. Right. So it's much higher than these things where you pay minus the residual value. I haven't kept an iPhone past 12 months in,

1:08:22I don't know, eight years, seven years. It's been a while. So like, I'm, I'm totally on board with the, with the iPad program. Like I understand I'm a sucker maybe, and I can probably get more if I bought it and then sold. I don't care. Just make it easy. Yeah. We had comments saying you'll own nothing and be happy, which is the standard. Stop calling it a subscription. It's an installment plan. Now this is, that's what changed. It's no longer an installment plan. You don't own it. It is just, it is a lease.

1:08:53A subscription of sorts. Yeah. Yeah. You, you, you pay and you don't own it and you have to either give it back or you just get a new one, but you just keep paying your, your monthly fee. That is the cost of the thing less its residual value. Right. So it's cheaper. I've been leasing cars for, I don't know, 20 years. Most people do. Yeah. It's the way, it's the way people go. I've had a car bill forever. I've also never had to worry about brakes or transmission or any of the issues that arise when you own a car for,

1:09:24you know, seven or eight years. So, you know, there's a trade off. Like I have, I've, I've gotten no value out of any of my cars and I get screwed every time I go back to the dealership. I get it. But I also like getting a new car every three years and I like having a relatively low monthly bill. It's a much lower bill than if, if you finance that same car, even over five years, it would be a much higher bill, right? Because it, it, you're, you're paying the car's cost minus its trade in value is what you're

1:09:55financing off with the lease. So this is that same thing. It's a car lease for your phone. It gets people into expensive things more often and more cheaply, just like the car lease. Except unlike your car lease, most of the car leases include service. This does not. This is no Apple care. You got to buy that separate.

1:10:16Speaking of car leases, my last car lease, I don't, I didn't know they were doing this. The service thing, the like included service was only for two years, but the lease was for three. So if anything happened in that third year, I'd be on the hook for it. We weren't, it didn't happen, but I thought that was crappy. And apparently that's common now. Yeah. That I experienced that. I bought, I had to get a new car because my old car died right during COVID. So it was like the absolute worst time to buy a car.

1:10:49So I was just like, hold on. This is weird. To answer, to answer your question in on the video, like personally, I wouldn't get it for a phone just cause I kind of use and abuse my phones. So, and I lean on Apple care pretty well.

1:11:08You can still get it. You can still get it. Yeah. You can add Apple care to these. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't like, it hasn't crossed my mind yet until most likely at the end of the month or early September. But then the thing that's really attractive as an editor is the machines. So like getting those and leasing them, which they already have been doing for their like business program, but like making it more consumer friendly is a interesting proposition, especially for like folks that are coding and developing an AI and creating

1:11:41stuff like that three year cycle is really, really helpful. Yeah. And just being like, okay, this is a $3,000 thing. I don't have $3,000, even if it's a good deal to buy it for 3,000 and then sell it in three years and get a new one. Like I don't have $3,000. I do have $80 a month. Right. So.

1:12:02That's a goodie. Um, were there any other comments? I didn't see any pop in. That's probably enough comic horror for this week. We're so far behind. We'll be more organized next week. I promise. We're, we're, and we're off on time anyway. All right. Well, thanks y'all. It was been really, really fun. Sorry for dragging y'all into some rabbit holes, but no man. Love the chat. That's what we're in it for. Yeah.

1:12:31And, uh, all right. So that's it. That does it for this episode of the macro park, Mac world podcast, episode number nine hundred. Jason, I did change. Before we started the show. Did you not? Jason said, did you make sure you change the number? And I looked, I said, yeah, I did. I did. Just before we recorded, I said, oh, don't forget to change the number. And you're like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Episode 994. Thank you, Jason. Thank you. Thank you. Roman. Thank you. Roman's not even here. Thank you,

1:13:02Brennan. That's the highest praise. I will take that. Um, yeah, it's been a pleasure. Yeah. Thanks for joining us. This is a lot of fun. Next week, we will have, um, Adam, um, another member of our video team to talk about folding phones, but, uh, Hey man, anytime you want to fill in for Roman, um, you know, just, just lock the door behind you and, and, uh, don't open it for an hour and a half. August 31st. I will pop in if, if needed to just rap about this new CEO.

1:13:34Definitely. It'll be fun. Uh, all right. Roman, write that down. Thanks to you, the audience for tuning in. You can subscribe to the macro podcast in the podcast app on Spotify and YouTube and macro at the podcast channel or through any other podcast app comments or questions. Hopefully we'll get to, we'll remember to write them down before next week's show starts, but you can contact us through blue sky, Facebook or thread, search a macro, look for the blue mask logo, comment under a video, comment under a post, send us a personal email, send an email to macro, the podcast,

1:14:05a podcast at macro.com and let us know your thoughts. And next week, we're going to talk about the iPhone ultra with, um, with Adam Patrick Murray of our video team filling in as producer for Roman, who is in Iceland. See you next time.

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