Feeling Wholeness through Shamanic Healing with Mujiba Cabugos

0:00Welcome to the Exploring Healing Arts podcast, your go-to source for learning about different healing techniques and meeting exceptional healing arts practitioners from around the globe. Together we explore where the physical meets the subtle, the possibilities that exist for healing, and a diverse array of methods to try from acupuncture to gyn yoga and Reiki to family constellation therapy. My name is Elizabeth Alexander. I am the creator and curator behind

0:32this podcast, a Reiki master and energy healing practitioner. This podcast is something I have dreamed of for many, many moons, and my intention is to birth the resource I wish I had had at the start of my own healing arts journey over a decade ago. Whether you are just getting started on your own journey, or you are intentionally diving deeper into a healing arts practice, this podcast is the place for you. You will hear inspiring stories, get real life practical tips, and connect with

1:04exceptional practitioners and teachers from around the world. No two paths in healing are the same, but that does not mean you need to be alone. Join us to explore and experience healing together.

1:22Welcome to a very special episode. We've got Mujiba Kabugas with us today, and she is a shamanic healer, a homeopathic practitioner, body worker, educator, and healing circle facilitator with extensive education and over 35 years of private healing practice experience. Raised in the Catholic community in Santa Barbara, California, Mujiba grew accustomed to speaking with spirits through the practice of

1:53prayer. Since then, she has been profoundly influenced by experiences with teachers of a variety of spiritual traditions and local indigenous elders. She maintains a devotion to Tibetan Buddhist teachings and is a faculty member at the Foundation for Shamanic Studies. Additionally, Mujiba is a registered nurse and maintains her RN license in California to stay connected with trends and mainstream medicine. Shamanic healing is currently the primary offering of her private healing practice. Welcome, Mujiba!

2:25Thank you so much, Beth. My pleasure. I'm thrilled to be here with you today. I know I have been blessed to experience the shamanic journey with you before. And I also feel very blessed from a friend who referred me to you and a somatic experiencing practitioner who had also referred me to you. So I just feel like those are the roots that led to this blossoming, this conversation happening today. Marvelous. Marvelous.

2:55So my favorite question to open with for all guests is what is your ancestry? What are your roots and how do you stay connected to them or not? Okay, so ancestry on a number of different levels, but on the ground ethnicity, I am Visayan, Filipino. My ancestors are all from the island of Bohol. My father directly, my maternal grandparents directly. And I'm so fortunate and so grateful that they had the wherewithal to come through

3:29by way of Hawaii and then onward to California. My maternal grandparents were homesteaders in the community of La Conchita down south. You might know of that because of the mudslides that had happened a few years ago. And I thought that that was so appropriate because as they looked out into the ocean, they saw islands. So that would be like, just like home for them. My mother was raised there in that community. And then when she married my dad, they came up here and settled in Santa

4:05Barbara. So we're all very, very local and feel very connected to this place. So that's Filipino. And then spiritually, I feel very connected in a lot of different ways to a lot of different traditions. I think that anything that has guided me in my travels worldwide, I was drawn to certain places or called to certain places because somehow it was a source of spiritual home.

4:42So places like Australia and Peru, of course, and in different places in Southeast Asia and Nepal, I felt that my experiences there and the actual connection with the spirits of the land there in each one of those places brought enhanced my resonance here, my spiritual vitality. So I'm greatly grateful to have had

5:16the opportunity to go where my soul was feeling drawn. So that's kind of in a nutshell, ancestry-wise. I love that. And I love how you are including the spaces that the land that you feel really connected to, too. I'm really appreciating that because I felt the same way about different places, but I've never really thought about it, ancestry-wise. And I think that's a beautiful connection.

5:48And so physically, where are your feet on the ground right now? And do you know the Native people of the land there? Santa Barbara, California. And as I was saying, I was raised here, born and raised here. All my brothers are born and raised here. Our children are born and raised here. My grandparents, aunts, and uncles are all here. Solidly in this community. This feels very much solidly our home. And yes, we have, over time, had and enjoyed a very loving and friendly connection with

6:25Shumish community here. And then as I was referencing spirits of the land, so spiritual connections or spirit connections, maybe even further back than the Shumish inhabitation here. And as well as including all others that have migrated here and called this place home. Everybody's blood and bones are comprising the soil here. So I honor all of it and everyone.

7:01Thank you. Yeah, we're all part of the land here. So we're just going to dive straight in. What is a shamanic healing?

7:15Well, shamanism is about engaging, connecting with and engaging with the power of spirits to affect the healing. And healing in shamanism is making one, helping one, whatever being it is, to become whole in its soul. As I was saying to someone yesterday or the day before, especially in our

7:46lifetime and in our culture here and the way we live our lives these days by and large, we have an experience of maybe through traumas and through whatever we experience in this life, a sense of dissipating, perhaps, or diminishing over time in our spirit vitality. And without a lot of opportunities to reclaim those parts back, a shamanic practitioner would engage with his or her own

8:24helping spirits to ask, how can we restore this person, this person's soul to wholeness? And there are a variety of common and universal kinds of practices that shamanic practitioners have developed and engaged with, have been taught by their helping spirits to utilize to that end. And so healing healing and a person experiences healing when they experience that feeling of being connected

9:00to all parts of themselves within one's own universe of self. And then of course, in the realization that that universe of self is inherently connected to the universe at large in all its layers and dimensions. So, so essentially shamanic healers work with spirits to do whatever they do. So that's the main distinguishing factor. And they have a certain way that they work with spirits. They journey out

9:32to non-ordinary reality, define them and engage them and be taught by them and serve as a kind of a bridge from those realities to our ordinary reality here on the ground. So how did you start doing the shamanic healing work? Because you come from a rich experience and teachings with over 35 years of private practice work as well. Where did it start? And like,

10:05how did you get here to leading these shamanic journeys and even teaching other people to lead, you know, be shamanic practitioners themselves? Yeah. Yeah. That, I mean, back when I was young, you know, none of this, I could never have envisioned any of this at all. I wasn't well educated in matters of spirit outside of the Catholic church growing up. However, the Catholic church and particularly within the,

10:41the, I don't want to say exclusively Latin or Mexican community here, but there was a very strong orientation towards the mystical aspect, mystical side. So lives of the saints and angels and miracles, you know, we were, we were, we were well inundated with all of that kind of, uh, experience and information. But beyond that, you know, I, I didn't know anything about nothing. I, from the time I was

11:17born, I was, I, it was projected that I was going to, and expected that I was going to be a nurse because my mother was a nurse, you know, and, um, and that's the reason why, uh, there was, uh, encouragement and support, you know, for me to go to college. Otherwise there wouldn't have been. My brothers didn't have that kind of encouragement in the course of life. At one point when I'd moved back from Santa Barbara, from some of my world travels, um, I was intrigued by this one little ad in

11:48actually in the Santa Barbara news press for, um, for a psychic development class by a man way back then in the late seventies. And, um, so I joined that class and at the end as a little bonus or as a little gift, uh, as we were ending that class, he, he got a tape, a drumming tape. He learned about Michael Harner and his work. Um, Michael Harner is the, the developer, the founder of core shamanism

12:19and, um, uh, taught us how to journey. And I was like, Oh, wow. Oh, wow. And you know, so, uh, that's how it started for me. Um, and I met Michael not too long after that, you know, for the first, um, class, someone that you're going to be taking soon. And so, um, and then it started from there and I, I'm kind of a slow learner. So I, you know, it took me quite a few years to really understand and

12:54to realize just how much that work, uh, was informing my life. And there I diverged from nursing school. I went back and got my nursing degree, uh, here at city college. And then, um, after working in the hospital for a little while, I promptly got a massage certificate from the hospital. Once again, we have a little group of, uh, renegade, I call renegade RNs. A lot of us started with body work or homeopathy or whatever. And so, so that started the journey.

13:31So between, you know, starting kind of having an instant massage practice, you know, and in California and especially through Santa Barbara, uh, it's, uh, you know, every kind of, it's a smorgasbord of whatever. And back then, you know, there were a lot, I mean, we were all didn't exactly know what we were doing other than tapping into systems and, and just kind of following our gut. And so I, in my own experience distilled, you know, found what I was, um, magnetized to, uh,

14:09in terms of healing practices, but I did stay, remain oriented towards, uh, developing, uh, with healing work. Now, you know, uh, that I've retired from daily practice offering homeopathy and body work. I'm completely retired from massage practice and, um, um, mostly retired from homeopathic work. Um, uh, I, my great love is to share the shamanic healing work. I, I really love sharing it. And, and I, in response to, to, um, our shifting, uh, relationship just kind of overall in humanity

14:50to the, our divine aspect, to what, what it is that we are in that level of ourselves in that dimension of ourselves. What are we as a soul and what do we do with that? How, how do we make it be more prominent, more central, uh, in our lives and live from that place, our wholeness, living from our wholeness? What would we be like if we did that more and more of us? So that's my

15:22interest. And that's one of, besides engaging with the spirits is, is it's still quite fascinating. And really, frankly, I find it really fun because the, the spirits are always basically turning, uh, me on my head, uh, me on my head and the way they respond to questions about life and, um, you know, what, what's going on. Uh, you know, that the, the spirit helpers have a, have a very

15:57interesting way of teaching, um, everybody's spirits do. And so mine seem to be some of them pretty humorous. Oh, it's always a surprise and it's always a delight, you know, for me to connect and ask a question, especially on behalf of someone else. Um, uh, it's always kind of fun to bring it back, especially their spirit power for him. Oh, I, if I deferred or if that, if I answered.

16:31Yeah, no. And I really resonate with the playful part. Cause like when I do, um, energy healing sessions, I always tell people at the beginning, I'm like, I don't know what's going to happen. Every time is different, you know, but the, one of the themes that comes through is it's almost always infused with a little bit of humor in some way that I didn't expect it. And I really appreciate that about spirit, I guess I should say. Yeah. The other thing that helping spirits have really helped to inspire for me is the

17:04encouragement of, uh, creative expression. So there've been different, um, kind of chapters or different eras in my life, you know, that I've been really happy to indulge that giving forth or extending the blessing or the vitality gleaned from spirit power through creative expression. So I had my dance era and I definitely had the music era. Um, I've formed, uh, a few acapella,

17:35women's acapella singing groups and made some marvelous music with, with other women. And, and then more recently, you know, getting into more, uh, graphic, you know, drawing. My latest obsession is Neurographica. Have you heard of that? No. What is that? Oh, I'm going to tell you. Sounds cool. I'm obsessed with it. And I haven't taken, you know, their certification course or anything, but I, I love, I love sharing it. And it, it's an approach to drawing that, um, was developed by this

18:10man, um, in Russia. I think he's a psychologist, but, um, his name, his name is Pavlov Piskarev, about maybe 15 ish years ago. He developed this approach and, um, it's, it's largely aimed the intention of it. And the actual form of it is for healing the nervous system. And so in your drawing, you are creating new neural pathways and working with them with a particular intention or to heal

18:49a particular challenge or obstacle or to expand a certain kind of capacity in your life. So you could take it in a lot of different directions and I'm really loving it. I'm just really obsessed with it. Um, yeah, the tutorials are all online and most, it seems like a lot of the, um, certified instructors for NeuroGraphica, uh, seem to be, uh, Russian women, a lot of Russian women. And so their offerings are really, um, and so enthusiastic and passionate about it. And, uh, so I'm, I'm very

19:25much enjoying that. So you want to see my latest one? Yes, absolutely. So this one is an example. Wow.

19:36Wow. And for people that are listening, it's got beautiful, like ocean colored tones. Yeah. So this is a reflection on, and, and, uh, and wanting to establish and strengthen neural pathways for dealing with, um, um, this latest stage of life as symptoms of so-called wear and tear on the body, especially, uh, aging, uh, are arising. Uh, you know, it's a big, a

20:07big phenomenon. I'm, you know, witnessing number one in myself and with my husband and, you know, friends all around that we're needing to pay attention and deal with this in a particular way because our generation has an expectation to remain vital and active and creative in, you know, what's considered this last chapter of our, of, of this life. And so, um, that was one for establishing some neural pathways for getting myself ready to deal with this.

20:41Wow. So that's an example of how, how you can work with it. And, and it's just, the sky's the limit on topics that you can make drawings about. The thing is that it starts with scribbling. It starts with scribbling. So lines, just lines all over the place intersecting and you, you approach making these lines. So it's kind of like an intentional doodling. I mean, they just basically really look like this. There's a certain way to approach neural lines, but you

21:16know, you just start with basically these. Then the next step is that anywhere that these lines intersect, you, you round the corners. And so it's like creating a neural junction. Right. You know, then there's certain other things that you add, but I'm getting off topic, but that's my latest creative thing. Oh my goodness. Thank you for sharing. That sounds very enriching. You want to explore that. Yeah. I'm like, I have a coloring book right now. That's mandalas and I'm working my way through

21:50that. But when that's feeling complete, I've got my next artistic inspiration comes. So thank you. This intersects with shamanism. I'm also drawing, you know, my neural pathways that in connection with specific spirit helpers. So there were animals I'm creating. And now I'm starting to even be inspired to, as a delivery of power, because one of the ways of delivering

22:21power, spirit power for healing to someone is to draw as inspired by your spirit helper. And that, that drawing will be infused with the spirit power. You give it to the recipient that they can hold to continue to activate and to energize themselves and stay connected to that spirit power that they just received. So now I'm being inspired to do it through that. Yeah. And you're taking something that's a lot of times, like I would call it under the umbrella of

22:56like subtle energy, right? Something that seems more esoteric or a spirit in nature, and you're grounding it into physical energy through your artwork. Which is what also what shamanism is about. Taking from non-ordinary reality from the spirit realms and walking it with practical feet. Shamanism is very practical. I like to describe ourselves, the shamanic practitioners as housekeepers of the soul, house cleaners of the soul. So we remove what

23:29doesn't belong, a lot of different ways, and restore and bring what can enhance and beautify and make whole. So if somebody was to, you know, sign up and come for a shamanic journey, like, I know the experiences having had a couple experiences with you, they can be different, and they can be variable. But are there some things that, you know, tend to be the same, like the length of time or the way that you connect or the way that they walk away feeling like,

24:00are there any things like that? Like, how would you describe it to somebody who's curious and has no idea what they're getting into? Basically, in my, there will be some form of asking the person to identify what their intention for themselves is. Not a lot of history or backstory really, you know, is really required. And then the practitioner will prepare the person, however, to make them comfortable. Describe, I will be consulting with my own spirit helpers.

24:35I make a little noise, and I make a little movement to engage with them to get myself in a in a particular state to be able to engage with them. I'll tell you what they advise. And then we'll do that. It might require me singing around you or light touch or other kinds of activity. And I'll describe that along the way. But fundamentally, it's me consulting with my helping spirits to ask them

25:06what we can do for you for your healing today. And then we'll just do that. So you just need to be present with me, be curious, and be relaxed in a state of receptivity. That's all that's required of you. I know from from my practices, it's been really helpful to continue to integrate even after like the shamanic journey experience. I'm curious, again, for people who have never tried it before,

25:39and maybe want to. Is it just like a one and done? Like they come and they see you for an hour and it's healed? Does it vary? Are there things that they'll need to do in the aftercare process? What does that look like? Yes. So all of the above. Lots of times people do come. And I don't hear from them and see them again for years, because I'm more laissez-faire. I'm not, not always, I won't say never, but not always in the habit of prescribing. You know, I leave it to the, to the, to the client

26:17to determine when they're ready, go inside, check with them, their own selves. And when they're ready to do some more work, there's always work to do. So sometimes I'll get a call from a person that I've seen maybe 10 years ago. You know, what you did back then really helped me so much. And then there are other people that like to come in a lot, you know, like frequent sessions. And then we work a variety of different ways. Lots of times what they receive in the shamanic healing

26:50really integrates well with other modalities that they're, they're working with. And it helps to maybe augment or amplify or speed along whatever progress they're making in whatever other way that they're seeking to grow and heal themselves. Sometimes the spirits, oftentimes the spirits have some kind of advice or suggestion about something specific to do to integrate the healing. Not

27:21always, but oftentimes. And that, that could be anything from take a walk in a certain place in nature for five minutes, three times a week to, you know, creating an altar or having a particular, doing a ritual once or twice or something, you know, keep a journal or what you're doing, you know, all kinds of varied. Sometimes they'll give me a song to deliver. Here's a song. You can sing it. You can sing it to keep vitalizing yourself with this healing spirit power that you've

27:56just received and keep yourself reminded and in that resonance, keep creating it yourself. So what kinds of things they advise for furthering the healing and yeah, come as frequently or as infrequently as they like, sometimes the work really goes very, very fast. The particular spirits I'm working with those days are my real one really big and we just go, you know, and there it is. And sometimes it's very gentle and very slowly

28:31paced and quiet. Uh, so yeah, that, that's another thing that it's never boring. Yeah.

28:43It hasn't been when I have worked with you. It's been really fun, actually fun and fruitful. So how might somebody like know that they need a shamanic healing? Like what are like, I know for me, it was like, I was like, I know I need some sort of support. And then like a friend mentioned their experience with you. And I was like, that feels, that feels right for me. And then I just waited on the timing of it, you know, but for people, yeah, just for people that are at varying

29:13levels of attunement to knowing that they need that. I mean, if it's your first time, you might not even know that this is an option. What are some of the things that people either come to get help with or some of the maybe signs and signals that they could look out for in their body or in their being that this could be a supportive practice for them? By and large, uh, the, uh, the, uh, the greater percentage of people have been suffering a long time. And you probably have experienced this too. They've, they've sought relief, uh, in a wide variety of

29:47places and the condition continues to exist. The suffering remains. And so oftentimes for homeopathy, as well as, uh, uh, shamanic healing, you know, we're seeing people who've been searching everywhere and somehow, you know, somebody ends up or they end up reading about, or they found it on the internet internet and the, and it resonates with them. This sounds like something I could possibly benefit

30:18from. And so if they're feeling it that strongly, they do, you know, look us up or if they have the gift of a friend or an acquaintance that happens to, um, suggest it, then, uh, that, then that that's also how they come. But by and large, it is, I don't that often, or historically for, for my own history of practice, it's not been from people who were specifically seeking shamanic healing

30:51or homeopathic healing. It's because they were suffering and somebody suggested it. So for something chronic, you know, so chronic physical illness, chronic emotional illness, um, depression is a huge one. People who've suffered like that depression and anxiety, and there's plenty of that to go around in our day and age, um, these days, people who've have, um, this feeling that there's something

31:22missing and they, they can't put their finger on it. Something in their themselves or something in their lives just feels missing. And they, they don't know how else to describe it. Sandra Ingerman's, uh, work and book on soul retrieval spoke to a lot of people, her languaging around that, because it came from her own personal experience of that. And, and then having soul retrieval

31:52healing. So that concept definitely has resonated, uh, with, with a lot of people today. And then the other forms of shamanic healing, not so much because shamanic practice, you know, it's not necessarily something that resonates for everyone, but people do relate to the idea that they do have some kind of spirit resource that's been helping them or that they can appeal to, or they're wishing they could

32:28appeal to, or they're hoping that it has been really there. And so shamanic practice hopefully serves to connect them to that. Spirits are real and they are really there for you. If you've made it this far in your life, you've had some spirit help. If you want to know more about that or feel that, or be able to work with that more deeply or more vividly, then, you know, this is one way, uh,

33:04to connect with this. And, and it is universal. It spans all the varieties of spiritual expression. It appears through anthropological and archeological work that shamanism, shamanic practice, connecting with spirits is perhaps the earliest known spiritual practice of humanity, going back tens of thousands of years, evidence of this. So it's a reclaiming of this particular

33:34spiritual inheritance that we can access this through direct revelation, through our own seeking. We don't need a middle man or a middle woman to be describing for us what to believe and what to subscribe to. We can go directly to our own spirit helpers and be taught about that and be taught about that. So that's what shamanic healing helps you to do.

34:09It's fundamentally what a shamanic work is about and honoring each person's ability or interest to do that. Respecting each person's spiritual independence or spiritual sovereignty in that respect. I don't know how fast you want to grow and expand and mature. Uh, but, um, you know, somewhere you have some resources that can help give you an idea about that yourself.

34:42So I know when I've done the two shamanic journeys with you, like we weren't in Santa Barbara, I was up here in Northern California and you were down in Southern California and we did them remotely. Is it possible to experience physical healing from something like that, that can be done remotely? And like, how does that work? Yeah. Like, how is that a possibility? So non-ordinary reality where the spirits abide outside of our, uh, consensual reality here in the

35:15physical is reality out of time and space. So shamanic practitioners have famously and, and, uh, always worked long distance being able to send spirit helpers to others over the distance. And work this way. But our, our grand experiment, uh, in this modern day has been, well, well, what is the interface through the internet? How do we, how do we do that? We know how to do it in

35:52person, our methods and practices, ancient ones and, and modern ones. And we know how to do it long distance, but this is, we can still, we still have some kind of physical connection. We can hear and see each other. And there is this medium of wavelength, if you will, uh, light and sound and electricity and, and radiation and magnetism, you know, all that comprise the, uh, computer world,

36:26the virtual world. So how do we operate through that? And so, you know, we've come up with ways, uh, the, the specific methods and practices where we can do that. And, and people are reporting, you know, that they feel, yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh, something happened here on my end when you did that. So it's, you know, we're, we're experimenting, we're playing with this and, um, having some very beautiful results, very beautiful results. Lovely. I know I, I felt it. I mean, but I've also been

37:01studying this for 10 years, you know, so it, but it was really, um, cool to experience that even remotely, even though we've, we've actually never met in person. We will, we will next week. We've never met in person before. Yeah. That's the other intriguing thing. I mean, there's people that I've worked with. I've never even seen visually. Wow. Cool. Until, you know, now that we have the internet. So all those years working long distance that, you know, lots of people I've

37:32never seen. Wow. Very cool. So I know you teach, you know, as a faculty member through the foundation for shamanic studies, what can you tell us is like unique about them, the organization and the teachings that you lead through their organization as maybe opposed to like going and learning from somebody else? So Michael Harner way back when he has two basic books, one that he originally wrote his, his, um, uh, iconic way of the shaman, uh, where he describes how he came into this work.

38:07And then more recently, his last book, Cave and Cosmos, where he describes how he came about this. He was, um, an archie anthropologist and was initiated by, uh, the Shuar in South America. And he was very curious about what he was experiencing through those initiatory happenings and connections with those people. And so he started to do research both, um, through the literature, as well as, uh, in his direct interface with, with shamans of different cultures, uh, around the world

38:43and found that there were certain methods and practices and concepts that were universal, global, or common. And so he gleaned that. And, uh, particularly for the methods and the practices, he choreographed the, the essence of these methods and practices, you know, to be doable in our modern

39:14times. And then, you know, experimented with a lot of us on this work. Will people have an effect from this much as, you know, what is described and what have I just experienced from indigenous practitioners and, and learned from indigenous practitioners and, you know, can a modern day person like me journey out of body to connect with helping spirits and our spirits real. So 50 years of investigating this.

39:46Wow. So way of the shaman describes how we started with it. Cave and cosmos is really beautiful because he, he even more succinctly outlines the nature of the practice. These are universal, uh, global, common elements of shamanic practice that everybody all around the world can recognize, understand, and has engaged in these concepts. And so, so once you become,

40:16become exposed to those, um, basic methods and practices and concepts, you learn to recognize throughout all the institutionalized religions, the religious traditions that, and any other spiritual tradition and any other culture, uh, shamanic culture, you will recognize the basic elements of spiritual practice of these spiritual concepts in all of that. And so many people,

40:46from a wide variety of other cultures, other traditions, they've been schooled and brought up with their own teachings and their own concepts from their culture that come and take the core shamanic classes go, Oh yeah, I recognize the fundamentals of that. They can take that, you know, to their own culture and to their own home. And, and it rounds out, uh, the understanding of what we're doing.

41:18So, uh, I found this to be really, you know, the, the, the entire nut of what is valuable has been valuable for me with core shamanic practice. It's, that's the, um, the moniker for it, core shamanism. Um, and so this is what we teach that, you know, these well choreographed, uh, methods and practices. We teach the methods and practices. You take that and see where you get with it.

41:50And, uh, hopefully, you know, number one, what you get with it is the connection with, to be able to find it's a discipline. It's a practice journeying. Uh, that's the other thing that characterizes shamanic practice that the shaman journeys out to non-ordinary reality to connect with the helping spirits. So when you bring all that back and even call those helping spirits here to ordinary reality, you know, very specifically who you're working with.

42:21So that's the other thing that really distinguishes, um, shamanic practice, you know, who you're working with. So if someone's looking for a shamanic healing practitioner to work with, I mean, obviously you are fantastic. A lot of people at FSS, the foundation for shamanic studies have also trained and practiced in this way. What would be your recommendations? Like what are green flags to look for when looking for a shamanic healing practitioner?

42:52That they describe their work this way, you know, that they've connected with their helping spirits, that they, um, engage in shamanic journey practice, you know, and they, and that they've trained in the methods and practices, both with what their helping spirits have taught them, as well as training with other shamanic practitioners. Traditionally, in any other culture, the shamanic practitioners have been trained one way or the other. And yes, by paying somebody, no, for the teachings and, and to guide their practice to, you know, that they,

43:30they woke up one day, they have had some kind of an experience. Oh my goodness, there's this stuff I'm dealing with now in these, with this invisible connection. What is that about? And then seeking, um, a teacher to help them understand what's going on with them. So there is a bit of training background. So, you, you know, you, you want to have some kind of idea that they, you know, they've worked at it a bit, worked at it a bit, but you know, that being said, you're going to be

44:01taking the way of the shaman basic workshop. You'll be able to offer after, as a result of that, uh, learning those methods and practices that are introduced in just the, the, that introductory workshop, you will have a couple of methods and practices that you can offer someone. Say, I just learned this. I need to practice it. Would you like, you know, to do this with me? You'll be able to offer that. So there's that level of it too, you know, sincere person

44:34wanting to see, and then the effectiveness of it is the proof in the pudding, you know? So there's no one else, you know, that can proclaim you to be a masterful shamanic practitioner. And, you know, it takes a certain degree of integrity and honesty with yourself to be able to state that. I, for one, in myself, I was saying that I, I'm a slow learner. I still, to this day, don't feel 100% or 105%

45:10confident to proclaim myself that I'm a practitioner. I'm a practitioner. And I quite frankly, am always delighted and surprised if it works. You say you feel better. Yay. Yeah. Because I deliver spirit power. I deliver some kind of inspiration, maybe some kind of a teaching for you. But the main nugget is the delivery of spirit power. Is that gonna, is that gonna help

45:47you? Will it help you? I hope it does. I hope it does. But when I give it to you, now it's yours. Mm-hmm. So if you, you know, apply your, uh, your attentiveness to cultivate that and to pay attention to it, then, you know, you'll derive even more benefit from it. Sometimes that's not even necessary, you know, but it's nice when you do, uh, have an interest in integrating the, the healing work

46:22and integrating the spirit power to expand your own understanding of yourself and embrace your, your wholeness. Lovely. Thank you. So what practices do you do personally to help you stay embodied? Like how do you ground and integrate your own healing work? A lot of things. Neurographic.

46:48That's my new thing. But, um, yoga practice, hands down yoga practice. Um, I've been a student of Vyengar style yoga, um, for many, many, many years and, uh, great appreciation for that. Um, it's for an aging body, you know, especially at this time of life, I'm finding it essential. Um, uh, and, uh, I never stop learning, you know, about being present. Also, you know, just free form dance

47:20meditation, not that age, you know, so I keep some dance in my life that way, even if I'm not performing any longer and athletics. So I paddle outrigger canoes and stand up paddling anything in the ocean to running, to hiking, to being out in nature. You know, my practice, my spiritual, my shamanic practice, of course, takes me out there to engage with the beings that surround us.

47:50So all of that staying very, very, very present. It's not about, you know, being, being in the shamanic state of consciousness and spacing out the whole purpose of going into the shamanic state of consciousness, that light altered state is to be more present. And when you have all these aspects of your soul retrieved for yourself, you can be more present in your life, more present in your life, to pay attention and to navigate it well. So yeah, I do, you know, a lot of things. I still,

48:27I don't necessarily make music the way I used to, but I still chant and tone. I formed a vibrational sound healing group with some friends of mine. We, we, well, we just celebrated our 25th year. We called ourselves Tingsha for the four guys and two of us women, all of us musicians. So my friend Lauren plays the harp and the guys are playing Native American and Indian and Japanese flutes. And I

49:02have, you know, various other musical instruments. And so together with the vibrational instruments, we have an enormous array of gongs and tomat and bowls and everything. And we are too old to lug around our stuff anymore. So it's lovely to see, you know, a new generation of, you know, sound healers coming on board these days that are very enthusiastic. But, you know, I still do that. We used to offer what we called harmonic renewals. And these were, uh, at the turns of season, big circles of people

49:38ceremonial, you know, ceremonial format culminating in the sound journeys with all of our stuff. So, you know, I still engage in, in that, um, also through, uh, the connections with my helping spirits. I, I received inspiration for creating performance pieces over time. So I mentioned the acapella groups and, uh, also, uh, multimedia, multi creative pieces along the way too. So life has

50:12been very full and very rich, um, in creative. And I always considered that the performance or the delivery of all of the, of all of these things or all of these venues or modes of expression were to expand the spirit vitality, to expand love, to expand, uh, enhanced resonance, um, to anybody who wanted it. I feel that in my heart. All right. So our last question, before we dive into rapid fire,

50:47if you could go back and tell a younger version of you, maybe the part of you that was like on track for nursing school, you know, go in and out of that, if you could tell yourself anything, what would it be? Oh, I'm glad that you followed whatever inspiration you followed. It was kind of like playing blind man's bluff, you know, had blindfold on and feeling around like this, not knowing

51:19anything, didn't know anything about anything. And so what, what is that? And learning and, you know, learning to engage it and deliver it and learning about the nature of ourselves as a result. So I'm glad you, I'm glad you did that. I'm glad you did that. I had no idea I'd end up like this. I'm very, I'm very happy. I ended up like this. Life has been rich. Beautiful. All right. So these are our five rapid fire questions. We do them with all guests at the

51:54end. Okay. Now this makes me nervous. Rapid fire. A rapid fire. So just a short and sweet answer. Just the first thing that comes to mind for you. What is your human design? I experienced myself as a transducer and capacitor to draw from the electronic world. Cool. Transducers transform and convert one form of energy to another. And a capacitor enhances the capacity,

52:27literally to store energy so that it can be delivered. And that's what, how I would describe the nature of the relationship with the spirit helpers is being able to expand the capacity to, to hold spirit power, to imbibe spirit power, and then to be able to convert it and deliver it in a way that's helpful. So that's how I experienced my human design.

53:00Lovely. What is your favorite place in nature to be in or where, where is your favorite place? Ocean. Ocean. Anywhere. What is your beverage of choice right now? Beverage of choice. Well, I love tea. Certain forms of mushrooms are, are, I'm happy to imbibe. And then, um, my wonderful daily indulgence is chai. Me too.

53:29What is your top tip for good energy hygiene? Good energy hygiene. So whatever helps you feel delight and awe and gratitude and bring a smile to your face. Do that. One person was saying, how can we, how can we abide? Here we are in beautiful Santa Barbara, sunshine, ocean, when there's so much suffering. We've got now in Turkey and Syria,

54:03this amount of devastation. And my helping spirit say, we need to continue to, uh, anchor this capacity for delight and joy, gratitude, kindness, and lovingness. We need to anchor that. We need to continue to cultivate that no matter what and bank it for these times and to extend it in whatever we

54:34feel whatever way and to whatever degree we feel we can. Somebody needs to balance the pain and suffering and sense of disruption and sense of degradation. We need this to balance that. Establishing harmony and balance. It's essential. Not flippantly having fun necessarily, but that experience of joy, delight, gratitude, gratitude, smile, kindness, respect for the balance. We're not in a vacuum. We're not

55:13isolated. It transmits. It transmits somewhere, however small, however wide it transmits. Your kindness transmits transmits. Believe it. I feel it. How would you define healing? Just that, uh, becoming whole, connecting to all these aspects and dimensions of yourself, feeling whole, and then in turn connecting and connecting and connecting to the ultimate wholeness

55:52in our connected universe. And if you have that capacity beyond.

55:59Beautiful. Thank you, Moojiva. This has been such an enriching conversation. This is marvelous. You, you're just so precious that you open yourself to this and, um, make this invitation for us to express ourselves, you know, because this, for so many years, it's not been, you know, that acceptable necessarily to talk about these things. And now it's wide open these days and there's a lot more acceptance and actually there's a lot more receptivity and hunger for it. So thank

56:35you for having this ability to number one, work with the technology. That's not my capacity, but, you know, that you feel yourself to be someone who can be a transducer in your way and a capacitor for this. So thank you very much. Thank you. It's been a great honor and privilege to converse with you about these things today. So if somebody wants to come and see you, like I do a shamanic journey,

57:06like I did, or come and learn with you in a workshop, where might they go to connect with you? Primarily because I don't necessarily, you know, cast about and advertise. Primarily my work through the foundation and my work as a shamanic practitioner, you can access at www.shamanism.org, shamanism.org. And that's the foundation for shamanic studies website. And so my classes are listed on there and, and all of that. And then my website is heartwaymuse, all one word,

57:43heartwaymuse.com description of me. And I think my email addresses are there too. And we'll link to those in the show notes. So for anybody listening that just wants direct access to either of those websites, they are going to be listed in tandem with this episode. So yeah, you can go get more info if you want it. If you're open and curious. Thank you, Mujiba. Thank you, Beth. Be well. Thank you. You too. Elizabeth here with a little extra show note. Mujiba and I just wanted to share with gratitude,

58:17a shout out to Joanne Chartrand and her work and the work of her partner as well. Joanne has been deeply impactful on both of our lives and helped to connect us. She is a somatic practitioner and works to hold family constellations, relational constellations. And you can find out more about her work at relationalconstellations.com or in the link in our show notes. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of the Exploring Healing Arts podcast.

58:48I hope that our words, our stories, and the wisdom shared on today's episode inspire you and support you in feeling connected. If you loved this episode, please leave us a five-star review so we can reach more people. And as a thank you for listening, join me for a mini course on energy hygiene. You get three simple practices you can do anywhere, anytime to support you in feeling more grounded, connected to yourself and confident in your energetic boundaries. Sign up at

59:22energyhealingelizabeth.com slash energy hygiene. Thanks for being here today. And I look forward to being with you again soon. The primary purpose of the Exploring Healing Arts podcast is to inspire and educate. As a reminder, the information and opinions shared on this podcast are not intended to be a substitute for professional advice, diagnosis, or treatment. We encourage you to speak

59:52with your doctor for professional medical advice or treatment. Opinions offered on this podcast are just that. Opinions.