Court and Spark – Joni Mitchell

Introduction

0:00Let's get into it.

0:30I'm Adam Ennis. And I'm Peter Martin. And you're listening to the You'll Hear It podcast. Music. Explored. Explored. Brought to you today by OpenStudio. Go to OpenStudioJazz.com for all your jazz lessons needs. Peter, we got a lot of cool stuff going on at OpenStudio right now. We've got new courses coming out from Larry Goldings, Daniel Anastasio, classical piano. Wait, say that again? Daniel Anastasio. I love the way you say that name. Classical piano. Classical. And by the way, a brand new course called Jazz Piano for the Bandstand from you and from me. A collaborative affair, much as this podcast is.

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Joni Mitchell and Court and Spark

1:13Peter. Let's do this. I am buzzing today. You are. I am buzzing today. This is, not only is this one of my all-time favorite albums, I think this is one of the greatest albums of all time. I really think this is peak performance from one of our peak performers, Joni Mitchell's 1974 masterpiece, Court and Spark. To me, this is where I step into Joni fully. I love folk music. I love quite a few other people. I love all of that stuff. But to me, this is where I was like, went from interested to obsessed with Joni Mitchell.

1:44I listened to the hell out of this CD so much. I think I've bought three of these CDs in my lifetime because they kept getting soda and coffee on them in my pickup trucks over the years when I was a kid. I love it so much. Every song, musically, she goes to another level. But I also think, lyrically, this might be her most slept on album because there's so many great stories, so many incredible lines in this album. I'm so geeked that we get to listen to this music today. Isn't it great? I love it as well. Isn't it great, though, when we have an album like this that you say that I bought it at

2:17least three times, coffee stains on it. It's like a book that you put notes in and that you savor. And that if you lose, like, if you give it away to someone, you almost want to because you want to go get another one because you get to kind of discover it again with that fresh copy. I know. Now we've got Spotify and Apple Music. Isn't that fun? Whatever. I mean, this will be with me for the rest of my life. Yeah. Like, I will have a copy, a physical media copy of this in some form or another for the rest of my life and I will cherish it. So... And then it's also, we should say, I mean, I think this of all, well, it's Joni Mitchell's

2:47most bestselling record, I believe, of all time. Yeah. Right? And so this is a lot of people's entry point, I think, either at that time or later. And it's always fun when there's a blockbuster album like this for an artist and there's a lot of, I think, artistic validation of that because that doesn't always happen, right? Yeah. I mean, this is very similar, I think, to Michael Jackson's Thriller or Herbie Hancock's Headhunters. Both of those albums were their bestselling albums of all time. Miles Davis kind of blue, perhaps. Miles Davis. And they're also some of their greatest artistic achievements.

3:19And I would put this, I would put Corden Spark in that category of, yes, it's her bestselling album. It's her most commercially successful album. And it's one of, if not, I think the most artistic, artistically successful albums. The achievement of this is unbelievable. Yeah. And the story behind it is really cool. We'll get to it in a second.

Early albums and songwriting

3:37I just want to do a little bit of catching up with Joni. Yes, let's do it. So Joni discovered in 1967, she gets signed to an album and really it's all through kind of David Crosby, who she was sort of dating and then they produced her first album together called Songs to a Seagull in 1968. She was also, she's already writing songs for other people at this point too, but this is sort of her introduction as an artist to the world, this cactus tree.

4:10There's a man who's been out sailing in a decade for the dreams and he takes her to a schooner and he treats her like a queen bearing beads from California with her amber stones and green.

4:29He has called her from the harbor. He has kissed her with his freedom. He has heard her off to starboard in the breaking and the breathing of the water weep. I mean, even in that introduction on her first album, you can hear, she's already separating herself from folk singers, her contemporaries.

5:01I mean, the melodic and what you could hear other examples from that album, harmonic sophistication that she's already bringing at a very young age here at her first efforts is already pretty staggering. Yeah. And that ability to, it's such a big part, I think, of her very distinctive voice. Uh, and her artistry, that ability to make these melodic leaps that inform the harmony in such interesting and unusual ways, you know? She's the greatest. Um, and when we talk about distinctive, and I think we're going to see this as we lead up and definitely in Court and Spark and everything that she's done up until now is, you know,

5:36when we talk about distinctive, you know, Paul Simon, Michael Jackson, Marvin Gaye, all these great singers, Stevie Wonder that have this distinctive voice, they're copied a lot. And well, I would say Joni Mitchell has been super influential on songwriters and singers. She's not actually copied successfully very much. How could you? Yeah, exactly. That's the distinctive. It's like trying to copy Thelonious Monk. Everybody's going to be like, oh yeah, you're doing your Joni Mitchell thing. Yeah, yeah. It's so distinct. But very influential. Very influential. And by the way, also, you know, we're not, you and I are musicians, we're piano players,

6:09which means we love the math of music. We don't talk a lot about lyrics on this show. I don't know if you've noticed, but she is a lyrical gangster. That is ridiculous lyrical output. That is unbelievable imagery. And this is like the theme of Joni's career is like, yes, she's a musician. She's an artist. She's a performer. She's a complete artist. She's a painter. She's a poet. She's a musician. She's an incredible performer. She's a producer. She does every, like her art. She remixed her own album. This one. The craft of art is what she does.

6:40Yeah. Very, very well at a very high level. She became a band leader. In multiple disciplines. She plays several instruments. She's one of the great vocalists of her generation. She's one of the great songwriters. She's one of the great poets. Like, unbelievable. Her second album, she now go on to make, Peter, an album of the year, an album a year, sorry, for the next four years. So she does five albums in five years before we get to Court and Spark. 69, 70, 71, 72. 69, her second album. Oh, how about this? Rose and flows of angel hair, and ice cream castles in the air, and feather canyons everywhere.

7:30I've looked at clouds that rain. Yeah, it's just both sides now from clouds, Peter. Yeah. That's her sophomore effort. She goes on to make Ladies of the Canyon the very next year, 1970. This, of course, brings this to our attention. Big Yellow Taxi from Ladies in the Canyon.

8:13That became an important sample. A very important sample. The very next year, she makes an album that we've covered here on the show last year. Yeah. Blue in 1971. One of my favorite tracks from Joni, California.

8:32Sitting in a park in Paris, France. Reading the news and it sure looks bad. They won't give peace a chance. That was just a dream some of us had. Still a lot of lines to see. But I wouldn't want to stay here. It's too old and cold and settled in its ways here. Oh, but California.

8:56California.

8:58We talked about it. Maybe the best use of California in a lyric. Yeah, it's so great. Of a melody. And I mean, you've already heard it on every example. We're going to hear it quite a few times in Chord Spark. The master of the major seven. Buddy. With like, I mean, the emotional pull of that. The greatest major seven composer ever, possibly. Yeah. I mean, and with the lyrics. Yeah. Ah. Yeah. Melody. 1972 ends her five-year, five-album run with For the Roses. This is You Turn Me On, I'm a Radio.

9:26Notice too, by the way, everything we've listened to, acoustic guitar heavy. A lot of one to four stuff going on chord change-wise. Very simple. It's like, you know, sophisticated simple. Yeah. But nothing, nothing like what we're about to hear. Right. And I'd say everything has been. Driving into town with the dark cloud above you. Also. In the category of folk, you could put it there. A little sloppy with the genre. Folk rock, folk rock, yeah. For sure. Not to typecast it, but. It's a great album. But that's going to change. So in 1973, after this album and this run that she goes on, she kind of, she starts to

10:02tweak her musical vocabulary. She starts to hang out with some jazz musicians. Not a great idea. I'm just going to say that right here. No, but she, she meets Tom Scott in the LA Express. Yeah. Who are in LA, obviously. And she takes a couple years off and she writes this album, Court and Spark. And there's such a different feeling to this from everything we, I mean, there are hints of, of this kind of stuff in what, what we just heard in those albums that we just heard. But this is like, oh my gosh, not only that, but she's almost 30 by the time she makes

10:32Court and Spark. You know, she's 24 when she makes her first album. She's, she's, she's 30 years old. She's lived some life. Lived some life. You could hear it in her voice. Her voice is a little more mature. Her, her playing has gotten very mature. Her piano playing is very, very mature on this album. And the songwriting blossoms into this, one of the richest harmonic and melodic color palettes that we've ever heard up to this point, along with incredible lyricism, along with the incredible melodies and a new production sensibility from these jazz musicians.

Title track

11:05So, Court and Spark starts unbelievably with the title track.

11:25That's a theme that plays on this album. It's that minor seventh interval in those dotted quarter notes. With a sleeping roll and a madman's soul. He thought for sure I'd seen him dancing up a river in the dark. Her voice is lower. Yeah. And the voice with piano as opposed to voice and guitar. She brings another flavor.

11:52Such a beautiful production moment. Ah. Hi-hat and the steel guitar. Yeah. Down there. Yeah. All of a sudden, this modal interchange thing is happening. She's borrowing from all these different keys. Her harmonics palette has gotten incredibly sophisticated.

12:23It seemed like he read my mind He saw me mistrusting and still acting kind He saw how I worried Sometimes I worry sometimes But it's not a gimmick, Peter. It's serving the song. The story of these lyrics, which are insanely rich. All the guilty people, they said they've all seen the stain

12:54On their daily bread On their Christian names I cleared myself I sacrificed my blues In these moments And you could complete me Where she just I'd complete you Let's the song speak for itself Is that Larry Carlton?

13:27Larry Carlton's all over this album So I wouldn't be surprised The more he reached me But I couldn't let go of L.A. City of the fallen angels Fallen angels, L.A.

13:43Chills, buddy, chills Musically, lyrically The story of the album has just been told It's like we just We just got an incredible introductory chapter Yes To what we're about to hear And it's got I mean, even though it's just the introduction And it's very much Like If you listen And you like it How could you listen? And I like it But it draws you in To like what's gonna come next

14:14But it also has a little bit of a Like Preparatory epic flavor to it Oh, 100% You know what I mean? We're about to go deep Yeah It's like with the little hints And I wanna throw something out And I never totally thought about it Because I've always felt that Joni Mitchell's Lyricism Her composition The way she plays guitar The way she plays piano The way she sings The way she navigates a melody The way she creates a melody Is so All that stuff is so well intertwined Yeah Right?

14:45But I'm I wanna just throw this out there And we can explore You can give me your opinion But we can also listen as we go to see Like Are her lyrics Sort of the top The king? You know And then Everything else is important But like It's almost like Everything serves the lyric Yes You know like the harmony It serves the story Yes That's the highest level Yes Sometimes it's very Sometimes it's so weird And the timing And even like When she'll go to a funny number of beats In a bar Yeah It's almost because That's the cadence of the story

15:16As she's telling Because her lyrics are very much Like you're telling somebody Yeah Like the greatest storyteller Yeah It's not about rhyming this And rhyming that It's about taking the listener On a journey You know She's doing right now On this album Something that it would take Three men In Tin Pan Alley to do Mm A musician A lyricist And an arranger To make something great Right Great point An orchestrator Right She's all of that right here And an accountant You forgot about that Yeah No but she is She's playing three major roles That used to be done By different people

15:46At the highest level Yeah Like that's what's so incredible about it Because she sets us up With Court and Spark That title track Which feels like something big Is going to happen Right And you know what she does next Yes Fucking delivers

Help Me

15:57Oh That Yeah Now the guitar Is driving Oh Help me I think I'm falling In love again When I get that crazy feeling I know I'm in trouble again I'm in trouble Cause you're a rambler And a gambler And a sweet talking ladies man Come on This reminds me of 1974

16:32Like this is some of my earliest memories I was four years old I mean not of this record It sounds like 1974 It sounds like L.A. to me Yes Like it sounds She's one of our greatest L.A. writers I mean writers about L.A. Yeah A Canadian Yeah Taking our jobs Yeah Well Woo Every one of the help me's Where Help Help She falls off of it In harmony Structurally they build on each other It's unbelievable It's a real call for help

17:04And you know great artists Have that ability to make it sound 70s Without it sounding dated Like it's totally This is timeless Like yeah It's timeless And it also takes you Specifically back to that time You know And you want to be there Again we're going to hit our flat 7 Up That's the theme

17:34The theme Now the best The best moment for me My apex Oh Didn't it feel good When we're sitting there talking While I am in all time Open up Open it up You dance with a lady With a hole in her stocking Ooh the mix on this Oh damn Flawless Yeah Didn't it feel good That's a little Stevie influence there On the Bee Gees And it feel good Help me

18:16I think I'm falling In love with you Are you gonna let me go there by myself We take that melody for granted now Because we've heard it so much That's such an insane melody Yeah So beautiful Yeah Unexpected I also Peter Just so you know This song runs directly into the next song

Free Man in Paris

18:35Free Man in Paris So we're gonna let it run directly in And then the two songs after that Kind of are one piece as well Which I think is a really cool thing I love that That's probably called Love this Larry It's that like It's that Great LA session Yeah Playing at the highest These cats are We'll talk about LA Express In just a minute They're a really really Incredible group of musicians

19:06It's gonna fade But it's gonna feel like We're picking right back up With the next track Free Man in Paris Check this out Same key Same tempo too right Close You know who this is about right About David Geffen Oh yeah David Geffen Right of course In Paris Yeah The way I see it

19:36He said You just can't win it Everybody's in it for their own gain You can't please them all There's always somebody calling you down I do my best And I do good business There's a lot of people asking for my time They're trying to get ahead They're trying to be a good friend And she knows Like her ranges Oh my gosh Like the nuances of each of the little micro ranges She's a master of that And she writes for that

20:07I felt unfettered and alive There was nobody calling me up for favors It's so good dude You know I go back there tomorrow But for the work I've taken on Stoking the star maker machinery You know what a flex it is To write an artistically viable and beautiful song About a record executive I know It's so literal too Like we really feel for David Geffen Oh he's so busy

20:38Well he wasn't a billionaire yet To his credit He wasn't quite a business But she does it to us She's like oh yeah He's trapped in this In his wheel In his Yeah I deal in dreamers And telephone screamers Lately I wonder what I do it for I had my way I just walk through those doors And wander Down the chandelier

21:11Chandelier Going cafe to cabaret That's a hard lyric to throw in there Maybe now I'll be you And I find That very good Going cafe to cabaret Is a great line I was a free man in Paris I felt unfettered and alive Nobody was calling me up for favors We don't throw the G word around On this podcast very often We really don't But she No genius She is legit Such a genius We throw that around every week

21:41We use it sometimes But she is truly We don't throw it around a lot We usually just say it Just occasionally Just once an episode She is truly a genius Has there been a record from 71 through 75 That we didn't use the G word? A gangsta? No Okay She truly is a genius So Tom Scott and the LA Express So it's Max Bennett John Green Larry Carlton And Tom Scott Were this jazz fusion band In LA This is what they sound like On their own From their Self-titled

22:121976 This is Midnight Flight Hearing an album is one thing But trying to play this stuff Is a whole other thing But that's exactly what we do And teach at Open Studio World class musicians Real instructors All in one place Go to OpenStudioJazz.com That's OpenStudioJazz.com Start your free trial today Back to the show Tom Scott involved In some very important records In the segment Tom Scott's a bad He's a bad dude My dad had a ton of

22:43Tom Scott albums too By the way When I was growing up Great music Remember he would He usually wasn't on the cover It'd be some like Mosaic picture or something Oh he had some covers Oh he had some covers He had some covers But yeah I know what you're talking about Yeah Start skiing hutch baby Come on man Sing it the vibe there That's the LA Express But you can hear This sort of like jazz Influence that's That's running through this But what they And that was the sound That I'm trying to think What's They did a TV soundtrack Tom Scott Oh the LA Express did Yeah Or I know Tom Scott Like that's the sound

23:14Yeah Of the 70s Like that's how great Yeah Television bumper music was It was so good man It was so good I'm up until the early 80s Okay the next two tracks

People's Parties

23:23People's Parties And The Situation Game Are both short But they They definitely Bleed into each other In fact for years I just thought this was one song Man That's so good So so good Woo All the people at this party They've got a lot of style

23:53Very Paul Simon setting She's doing here by the way They've got passport smiles Some are friendly Some are cutting Some are watching it From the wings Some are standing In the center Giving to get something Photo beauty gets attention And her eye paint's running down She's got a rose in her teeth And a lampshade crown One minute she's so happy And she's crying on someone's knee Saying laughing and crying You know it's the same release

24:25I told you When I met you I was crazy Cry for a soul beauty Cry for Eddie in the corner Thinking he's nobody And Jack behind his Joker and Stone Cold Grace behind her fan And me and my frightened silence Thinking I don't understand I feel like I'm sleeping Can you wake me? Man You seem to have A broader sensibility I'm just living on nerves And feelings With a weak and old

24:56In fact that she holds it For this And coming to people's parties Fumbling deafdom And blind I wish I had more sense of you Keeping the sadness at bay Throwing the lightness On these things Laughing it all away Here's the heart She could have done a whole other

25:27Verse chorus of that But she does it Laughing it all away Love that Laughing it all away We're going to switch the palette A little bit But it's going to feel Very seamless Although not on this Yeah Yeah We're in 3-4 now

The Same Situation

26:03Tethered to a ringing telephone In a room full of mirrors A pretty girl in your bathroom Checking out her sex appeal I asked myself When you said you loved me Do you think this can be real?

26:26This And that harmony there is not Joanie goes there occasionally But that's not part of a regular rotation So it has even more You know I'm going to back it up Listen to this Listen to how the Rhodes comes in here The production Right here Oh

26:57Isn't that so That's buttery That's buttery Joe Samples On a lot of this But I don't know Specifically what tracks But Oh She uses on this album And a lot of her albums Those plagal movements Those movements that come down in fourths Instead of fifths Right So not like a perfect cadence But this plagal churchy thing That she does Fun fact When I was young I confused

27:28The plagal and the pagan cadence Exactly It was very confusing Exactly Yeah I love this line right here Like the church Like a cop Like a cop The way she says Like a cop Yeah There it is Wondering who's there to hear

27:58Dare I say like Soundtime-esque Almost that little move A little bit Yeah Send me somebody Who's strong And somewhat sincere Send me somebody who's strong And somewhat sincere Amazing Her Lyrical directness To The goat I think Because I mean There's other great Like kind of folk writers That do that But because of her harmonic You know Sophistication At the right time But mainly her melodic Leaps and stuff Yeah It makes it like So she can get away with

28:28Yeah That directness That's so exciting You know It's like a movie maker I know That just shows you the story Exactly as it is But all the drama Is built into it I know I'm gonna get hate For a lot of like Dylan heads Yeah But it's like If Bob Dylan Had more musical jobs Like No shade on Bob Dylan He's He said it No no He's the greatest lyricist But Joni Mitchell is up there Yeah Like can do What he does And also Yeah Has this like Unbelievable musical prowess Like that is so It's

28:59It almost makes me emotional How good she is In this period On this album Like the The harmonic moves The melodic moves But then also the stories She's telling Are sometimes very funny Yeah Sometimes Very heartbreaking And she's so Very human Very human Also very human And just like To me this is one of those things It's like when I see a great film Or I see a great show A great concert Where I'm just like Man Human beings do a lot of shitty things To each other But sometimes we do this That's right You know what I mean Sometimes we make this for each other And that's really really beautiful

29:29I agree And I think That directness With the With the Lyrics But such Lived experience Behind them So the stories are just Joyous Or heart wrenching Or whatever she's putting across But that combined with Like as we said The harmonic sophistication But not to the point of like I actually don't really buy this Like oh she went jazz on this To me That's not what this is about Because a lot of her I mean there's nothing like So crazy that she invented

30:00Harmonically I think her genius With the harmony I mean certainly you compare it To other folk Or rock artists You could say like Oh yeah she's using A lot more Sophisticated harmony But this is not like Full on jazz Or anything like that Or substitute It's the combination of everything It's the combination But it's also the taste making Of when she uses them It's not It's always connected With the lyrics And the melody And the same thing With the melody She'll do a lot of like Diatonic major stuff But it's like She knows right when to land With that lyric Right at that major seventh And like the emotion Yeah And then the combination

30:31Rhythm Well the four right Lyrics Rhythm Harmony And melody I don't think anybody's better Especially during this period I mean there's one person I would put up I'd put them in the same league Stevie Wonder Yeah As being able to like Master all those There's a lot of great writers That can do the three But then you add the lyrics in And how that becomes Sort of the tastemaker One more element To your formula The fifth element We'd like to say I love that band Great Is on this album specifically The sound Like when that Rhodes comes in It comes in with a purpose We're gonna call that Jill Sample Because I love Jill Sample We don't know if it is Jill Sample

31:01But it's probably Jill Sample Yeah But it's like When that comes in And it's like It puts butter in the dish All of a sudden And which is really I think Is more a testament to the I mean obviously great playing Whoever's doing it But the mix Yeah Mix is unbelievable The placement of it The chorus I mean buddy we're in 74 This is the king of the kick drum Right here It's literally the greatest Like everything ascended to 74 And it's just been a And like 74 It's AI slop mixes now right We're getting now To the point of the album I love AI slop We're getting to the point of the album Where the next two songs Might be two of the greatest recordings

31:32That Joni ever made And the first one of those two Stick around for the one after this So everything before this slop Crap No everything before this genius But this

Car on a Hill

31:40Car on a hill and down to you Are I think This is where This run is the apex Of the album For me It's at the right place On the album This is some of the great Session playing Oh Just that little intro There's a couple of chords On this track That are heartbreaker chords Yeah Heart melter Maybe heart melter chords No business being so emotional Yeah But they are

32:10The placement of them This little pre-chorus He makes friends easy He's not like me I watch for judgment Anxiously Nowhere in the city Can that boy be Yeah I'd give my right arm To be able to write something like that Climb Climb Climb Climb Climb Climb Climb Climb Climb Edit

32:42You heard it? Yeah Yeah There's that theme again Oh yeah This is very Actually very stevious Yeah High level flute playing

33:13By the way There's the theme Oh That's Crazy This is kind of Dan-esque there Very Dan-esque This is This whole thing has a Steely Dan Yeah Tinge But it's a little more A little more human You said it Turn it off Mute that out No man It's got a little more I mean it's clean But it's got a little more edge

33:44This line here This Sweetness Sweetness Sweetness Sweetness from the harmony And the lyric Where the chord goes And the lyric to the chord When there's so much sweetness In the dark And it goes to that That Like minor 11 It's like a minor 11 thing Unbelievable Weird 70s segues

34:14I love it I'm here for it Thank you Joni This is unbelievable That And that theme Of that Like That Three over four Dun dun dun dun dun That's throughout Almost every song On this album There's something That's on Help Me It's on Court and Spark It's on Free Men in Paris And then Peter Next up I don't know Do you love Perfect songs? Because we got one That I don't know

34:45Oh Oh Oh Oh Oh Oh Oh Oh Oh Oh Oh Oh Oh Oh Oh Oh Oh

Down to You

35:02Oh

Down to You

35:03Everything comes and goes Marked by lovers and styles of clothes Things that you held high and told yourself were true Lost or changing as the days come down to you Down to you Constant stranger, you're a kind person

35:34You're a cold person too It's down to you You go down to the pickup station Craving warmth and beauty You settle for less than fascination A few drinks later you're not so choosy

36:04When the closing lights strip off the shadows On this strange new flesh you found Catching the night to you like a fake leaf You hurry to the blackness and the blankets To lay down an impression and your loneliness In the morning there are lovers in the street

36:38They look so high You brush against a stranger and you both apologize Incredible line Old friends seeming different You must have brought that on Old bonds have broken down Love is gone Ooh, love is gone Written on your spirit this sad song David Crosby on some BBs there Yeah Love is gone Transition

37:08A little bassoon A little bassoon solo, buddy I forgot about that Bless you Bless you Bless you My brother This is so epic, man Tempo

37:45Push, pull back, push A little sharp 11 So good So, so, so, so good Wasn't this a multi-platinum record with all this? Yeah, man That's crazy What a time Crescent

38:22Crescent Polychor Oh, so, so, so good E-horn there?

39:00Yeah, more oval, clarinet.

39:03I wonder how much that's Tom Scott. He's listed as woodwinds.

39:10Everything comes and goes. Pleasure moves on too early and trouble leaves too slow. So good. Pleasure moves on too early. Trouble leaves too slow. You finally got it made. Bad news comes knocking at your garden gate. Knocking for you. Ooh, constant stranger. You're a brute. You're an angel. You can crawl. You can fly too. It's down to you.

39:41It all comes down to you. So sick, dude. It's so good. It's just the greatest. We haven't even talked about, we've been talking about Joanie the lyricist, the arranger, the composer, guitar, piano. We haven't really talked about the voice. Oh my God. Right. Are we just taking that for granted? We are taking it for granted. So we, you know, all this stuff. Like the instrument. Yeah, the instrument itself. This is what I was saying when we started it. It's like you can hear a clear delineation between the album before this.

40:16Skip ahead here. Oh honey, you turn me on. I'm the radio. She's getting there, right? But compared to what we just heard, it's like it's getting, there's like a lower, there's a lower resonance that she, especially earlier in her career, didn't have yet. And she's really like come into her own vocally here as well. Yeah, and I've always felt like the way her, for sure, her voice, I mean, as all voices evolve, it was at a pivot point maybe a little bit, but also the way this, her voice was

40:48recorded on this album. And that's always, you know, shout out to Henry, Louis and Ellis Sorkin, the engineers. We never give the engineers enough. They crush this one. But all these decisions. High fives all around, guys. Yeah, yeah. And how the decisions are made. I know Joanie's always very involved with that process too. She's very much, she's one of those types of musicians. But I always felt like this was the, like just the quintessential way to present Joanie's voice. Yeah, I agree. You know, like there's a, there's a lot of variety over the years, not just as she evolved,

41:19but the way she was recorded. But I always felt like this, because like there's so much beauty, obviously in her voice, she has a beautiful voice, right? Yeah, yeah. But then she has so much control. So there's like a purity there that she can go in and out of that she totally controls. This is not unique to her, this, but this is like when you're in that S tier of vocalists that have an incredible voice and can control it. And then you've got the, you know, the, the lyricism and all and the phrasing. Yeah. Oh my God. And then you capture it great, like you said. And then when it's captured great and you, and I don't know, to me, this kind of voice,

41:52the more direct and more simple. I mean, it's not huge either. Like her voice is, is, is big. It's a big voice, but it's not presented in this like grandiose way. It's just like, just the facts. Well, that's what's so great about it is it feels like intimate. It feels like having a conversation with someone. But it's like, you know, like if you're taking a picture of someone, a beautiful portrait, not a whole bunch of, but like really natural lighting, right? Like this is a very natural way to record her voice.

Just Like This Train

42:15Next up is Just Like This Train.

42:20Oh yeah.

42:26I'm always running behind the time. Just like this train. Woo. Shaking into town with the brakes coming plain. We're four to two. Can we get some more pedal steel around here, buddy? Yeah. Joni's four to two back to one game is unmatched. Unmatched. Truly.

42:50Her Lydian too. Her Lydian stuff on this album is incredible.

42:58Yeah. If you don't know. The four to six is pretty damn good too.

43:04This chord you hear all over. This is when we talk about like Lydian stuff. Sharp 11. This is more even. And I think what she did this is like. This is like a D over C, right? So it's like a D7 with the seventh in the bass. Where you can resolve to like that G. But she's using like. There was a major seventh in there too, I think. Was there also like. Yeah. Yeah, it's gorgeous.

43:31Just so harmonically sophisticated. You know what it is like. And she works into the writing, how she connects the melody and the lyrics we talk about with the harmony then. And so this is a harmonic concept, right? Lydian, like these are cores. This is vertical. Like her understanding. Like she was somewhat famously didn't have a lot of theoretical knowledge of this stuff. I think there's stories about her being in the studio and she's like playing these minor 11s and stuff. She's doing shapes. Yeah. Yeah. And somebody said, oh, that's that minor 11s. She's like, what is that? Which by the way, everybody, is totally cool.

44:03Well, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Look at the output. Some people feel like you got to wait until you know everything. You don't. Well, if you're not Joni Mitchell, you got to know everything. No, you don't. You just use your ear. You do what you want. Right. But it's like the output. But like her ability to. There is a part of theory, actually, that is about understanding the unspoken emotional impact of different sounds. And it's never, we always think about it as, like I said, the vertical, right? Because it's a chord. No, no, no. You know, like when we're singing, like as pianists, we'll play it.

44:34But singing, you can never, I mean, unless you're Layla Hathaway, you can't sing more than one note at a time, right? So it's about, that's the most natural connection with which great vocalists and great writers like Joni understand on a level that's harder for us to understand. But it all comes down to what is the emotional impact of the sharp 11? Not what's the math of it. The math explains it. But then the ability to go there when it's like, it's kind of happy, but optimistic, but it's a little bit forlorn. And you can't, you can't say what it is. That's why we have these sounds, right? You know what she does a lot on this too, speaking of all that, is like if she's in the key of C here, she's got these like, we talked about the plagals, right?

45:10Where she. Take it to the church. Yeah. And when she uses the Lydian sound, she'll do something like that, right? She'll, she'll go from this close, kind of like really warm, but boxy progression. And then she'll let the sky open up. Yeah. Yeah. By doing that sort of like sharp 11 Lydian sound. Because at that time it's, it's as much about where it's going to go. Exactly. You know. Exactly. And she's got that control. Next up is Raised on Robbery. I think this is definitely Joe Sample on the Clavinet here. Yes. I mean, I've always, this was the only one I always knew was him.

45:40Ah. I love you, Joe. He was sitting in the lounge of the Empire Hotel. He was drinking for diversion. He was thinking for himself. A little money riding on the maple leaves. Along comes a lady in lacy sleeves. She says, let me sit down, you know, drinking no loans and shame. It's a shade, it's a grand shade. I've always thought like, this is a track where it's like, is it blues? Is it Americana?

46:11Is it country? Is it folk? It's kind of everything, right? Rock. It's what I'm drinking and I was raised on Robbery. It's almost like, like a Fleetwood Mac. They could get away with doing this too. Fleetwood Mac or Elton John. Yeah. Something like that. Billy Joel maybe. Yeah.

46:30I'm a pretty good cook, sitting on my groceries. The lyrics of this are actually amazing. I'm up to my kitchen. I'll show you my best friend. Oh, control. I try, but I can't say the same. I'm up at the midnight cook, trying to make my rent. I'm rough, but I'm pleased and I was raised on Robbery.

47:00And even though there's so much thick backgrounds on this, like this track, I think on the whole album is the most where she's placed in the mix, almost like inside of the band. Yeah. Like almost underneath. There's something on her voice too, some kind of delay or reverb or something. Yeah. It's very intentional, I think. Taking her back a little bit. Yeah, right.

47:24Yeah, she's just in there, right? Yeah, what would you call this group?

47:38This is like a classic 70s rock group to me. Yeah. It feels like, but it's got like, doesn't it have a little hint of shuffle on it too though? Not really. That dickens. This feels like anything from like Rod Stewart during this time, Maggie Mae, you know, to like, like you said, Fleetwood Mac or Emerson, Lick and Pomp, maybe not that, but that kind of genre, right? And it's really kind of an outlier on this. But it'd be hard. Like, could you imagine make a chart and be like 70s rock vibe? Yeah. Because that can be a couple of things.

48:09Next up is Trouble Chubb. Great song.

48:14Penultimate, right? Yeah.

48:19It's a well-sequenced album. I forgot about that. It is so well-sequenced. Almost perfect.

48:27Perfect.

48:30Is that Lydian again? Yeah.

48:35I feel like we, as jazz players, we waste that sound too much. It's so powerful when she does it. I know. It's like she's using taste. We just throw it around as a...

48:47Countermelody.

48:49Chuck Finley on the drum. You can't live life and you can't leave it.

49:19Yeah. Slide. Advice and religion, you can't take it. You can't seem to believe it.

49:31The peacock is afraid to parade.

49:36You're under the thumb of the maid. Yeah. You really can't give love in this condition Still you know how you need it. Trouble Child.

49:51All right, Peter. We're going to end with a cover. The only cover on the album. Yes. Oh, is it? Yeah, I guess it is. It's a cover. This is by Annie Ross of Lambert Hendrickson and Ross. And this is actually written... The melody is from a solo by saxophonist Wardell Gray. Right. I always thought it was... Well, you've got the facts. For some reason, I always thought this was James Moody. But it's a famous solo. You're going to have to argue with Wikipedia. Oh, I'm sorry. You got the... Do you have the premium membership?

50:20It's a blues. This is a blues. Yeah, and it's just... I think it's... Well, look. I want to experience this, as I said, like coming from where we just were because it was always a little jarring to me. Okay, okay, sure. Yeah.

Twisted

50:30Twisted.

50:33I mean, the playing is great on it. Chuck Finley on the trumpet. My analyst told me That I was right out of my head The way he described it He said I'd be better dead than life I didn't listen to his jack I knew all along That he was all wrong And I knew that he thought I was crazy, but I'm not Don't know My analyst told me That I was right out of my head He said I'd need treatment But I'm not that easily led

51:03He said I was the type That was most inclined Went out of his sight To be out of my mind And he thought I was nuts No more ifs or ands or buts I mean They say as a child I appeared a little bit wild With all my crazy ideas But I knew what was happening I knew I was a genius What's so strange When you know that you're a wizard at three I knew that this was meant to be

51:34Chuck Finley's killing it We're supposed to sleep tight That's why I got into the vodka one night My parents got frantic Didn't know what to do But I saw some crazy scenes Before I came to now Do you think I was crazy? I may have been only three But I was swinging They all have been angry young men They all have been Edison And also had Einstein So why should I feel sorry If they just couldn't understand

52:05The idiomatic logic That went on in my head I had a brain It was insane Oh, they used to laugh at me Technically what she's doing Is off the charts But you don't dig it I want to hear what you think Hold on I want to hear Cheech and Chong Okay That is a pump pump My analyst told me That I was right out of my head But I said did I had some great Cheech and Chong albums From this era Hell yeah Yeah How many LPs?

52:34The mix on Joanie This is the only track on the album Which I think is weird Like she's not with the band And you know Two heads are better than one It's a jazz tune Without a jazz mix Isn't it? Yeah Yeah And I love the mix on this album And it's kind of like There's some other albums I know like There's like an add on track It just doesn't make sense to me I agree it's an outlier But I still find it delightful And I feel like You're a no fun guy right now Come on We can't have fun around here But you know what I'm hearing it again

53:05I hadn't heard this in a while Joanie's singing is stunning on that I mean she's not I don't care about this Is she a jazz singer Is she not? I mean she's singing that You know And if you want to call that jazz Then yes She absolutely is That's not her main jam She has these connections To me actually Now that I'm remembering It's like the rhythm section To me Is a little bit like I hear you Chuck Finley's killing And I mean Once you push Into something That's going to date it A little bit Like I'm jumping I'm putting on a costume Right And we're going to We're going to go to jazz land For a second We're going to go jazz hands

53:36It's got a little bit of that It's so well done That it kind of works And Joanie is the Connective tissue I think from everything What did you just write down? Are you cursing me? Yeah Are you stealing my passwords? What's going on? I'm just writing about Must get new friends I'm just kidding I'm just kidding I'm just kidding No I'm writing down my categories Because it's time for some categories Peter what's your I want to know what you think of it though Hold up You're kind of shirking Your responsibility on that I agree with you about the rhythm section And I agree with you about How it was recorded But I do think it's really fun And I think her performance Is pretty amazing Yeah Do you think it fits on this album?

54:07Is it an app? Does it take away from What may be a perfect record In some ways Or in that category It does not I think if it were the third track It would I think because it's the last track We're going out on a bit of humor It's almost like the credits are rolling On a very like fun Because there's other funny moments in this album Yeah There's humor throughout it And so I feel like She's going out on a lighthearted moment And I think it's really fun Fair enough It's only two minutes long too It's a very short way to go out Yeah Okay Desert Island tracks

54:38What do you got? Mess up perfection That's what they say Desert Island tracks So I think I'm really ill prepared I mean I think I'm going to go help me Because I've always loved that And like Wake me up in the middle of the night Thinking about this record But down to you Hearing that I hadn't heard that in a while That's It's unbelievable Yeah So I'm going to go either one Can I go too? You can go too Okay I'm going to go with Car on a Hill I think I think Car on a Hill Is now After many years I think it's like So incredible

55:09And I love a little epic moment In the middle And when it comes back With And just that one chord When she sings the lyric So much sweetness in the dark Here I'll cue it up here After it comes back From the epic part It's one of my favorite moments in music That line with that chord I think is like It will always give me goosebumps

55:39Never fails to give me goosebumps That's great That's saying something Apex Moment What do you got? Okay So I love The transition from People's parties To the same situation I was remembering On LP It just goes straight through Great yeah Man Can we give a shout out And one of the Can we bring back Or should we just love it? I miss it It's really the medley The 70's medley I miss it I miss it Like you know it If you Superwoman into Where Were You When I Needed You Like from the radio You never would know But it's just like one song

56:09But when you get the LP And you start to love it And you're like oh And then there's no bump Going into We still had it during the CD era But we seem to have lost it During the Spotify era Hell yeah we did Love you Sweden Spotify not so much I have For me I have the bridge To help me After the second verse The drums go to the Bell of the Rye cymbal This is all very tight Through here Yep All of a sudden Everything starts to open up

56:40And that's the And her melody Oh didn't feel good We were sitting there Talking lying in the dark Is unreal Yeah Back to that Yeah That's gonna set it up Convertible Convertible tops down We're up in the canyon roads You can smell the salt water Yes It's so amazing

57:11The curvasseur The curvasseur Yeah Curvasseur water Snobobiter What do you got On a scale of 1 to 10 How snobby is this album I'll tell you what I have first I mean I'll tell you what I have first I think it's a Oh I'm sorry I'm sorry Peter I'll tell you what I have first Is there somebody else In the room with me I feel like I'm alone I have a 5 Why did you tell me first I knew there was a reason I was ignoring you Okay good Don't even say anything

57:41That's it I'm gonna go 2 on this What the what I mean this is Joni's biggest hit That's true Everybody loves Okay There's some people that are like Feel like they're not Sophisticated No I wouldn't say that To appreciate Joni Like she's not She's in that rare breed Of artists That you could almost say Everything that she does Except for people Have a low Low level of attention span Nowadays But if it was back to when People weren't so distracted You could say Everything she does Is a 1 or 2 Yeah

58:12Recorded You could make an argument I hear that So that's why I would say 2 And this is her You know biggest hit record I put 5 Because I do think Some of the sophistication Some of the arranging As an album I don't know It's not Drake It's not It might be her But it's still her best selling But there's still These amazing chords I don't know Yeah But that was That was the time It's a tough one Yeah Is this Okay new category Yeah New category from producer Liz Yeah Is this Joni's best album Yeah I mean I think so But I don't know her

58:43Total output enough To really Say that And so that's a safe answer For me I would say that Yeah the correct answer Is yes That's what I said I know You said I think so Hey Adam can I go first You said I think so Which is incorrect It is yes So the correct answer For me Or for you What's your answer It's yes It's for everybody It's yes What happened to The other categories I don't know Liz What happened to our categories Accouturements Accouturements Joni did Make the cover herself Which is again

59:13Super gangster This isn't the cover Joni Mitchell Joni Mitchell is An art gangster She's the greatest Yeah Thank you Joni Thank you so much Thank you Joni Mitchell And thanks Shout out Tom Scott For sure Joe Sample The whole band Except on the last track Unbelievable Okay Until next time You'll hear it You'll hear it