Copycats, Cowboys, and the Conversation We're Not Having

Podcast Introduction

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1:00Hello, everyone, and welcome back to a special one-off podcast episode. So obviously, for those of you that have been here, or not been here, I guess I should say, the podcast has been paused. It is still paused. I'm going to preface it with that, although I am planning to bring it back later in the fall. I have some really exciting things planned, and I'm just trying to take the summer to kind of get my head on straight with all of that. So I respect, or I am just so thankful that all of you have kind of respected me through this process and as I'm navigating these things.

1:31But I had to get on here because it has been a week, and there's just something I have to get on to talk about. And that is all of this content around copycats in the art space. So I'm recording this on Friday, May 8th. So I posted two reels this week, and I put something on TikTok. Same content, just posted there as well. So not sure how you found me or came across this copycat content. It was kind of all over. But I was talking to some artists. We talk about copycats. I've had multiple of my coaching clients get copied recently.

2:05And then I also was talking to another artist who put up some content in her stories about people copying other artists. And I just was in my DMs talking to her, and I was like, this is obviously problematic, and it's really prevalent right now. So, and sorry, I'm not even preparing notes for this because this is such a kind of spur of the moment episode. But what I want to get into today is all of that happened. So I decided, you know, I'm going to post a video about this. It's just clearly something that's top of mind for all of my clients, for all my friends,

2:37for all the artists I work with through my various ventures. And then lo and behold, there was a video that was going viral kind of around the same time. And it was these specific kind of cowboy-esque paintings and a girl showing, like, I can't afford these paintings, so I'm going to DIY them myself. Here's how you can too. You might have seen it. It was going very viral. And so I was like, wow, this is, you know, this is prevalent. It's not only artists copying other artists. It's people copying artists and kind of profiting off the exposure or, you know, gaining followers,

3:09et cetera, from other artists' styles. There's been a lot of discourse in my comments. I would say less so on Instagram because I feel like my Instagram audience is very insular, very artists. We support each other. They're like, yeah, go Haley. Yeah, take down the copycats. On TikTok, quite the opposite. There's a lot of people being like, I see no problem with this. It's probably because I don't have as much of a defined artist audience on that platform. So what I want to get into today is that. I want to get into the particular copycat video of the cowboy-cowgirl art.

3:46And then also, at the same time, there were two pretty big artists in my mind, just based on follower counts and knowing them, who also kind of came into a scandal of, like, who came up with an idea first. I'm not going to name names because I just don't want to do that on this podcast, but you might have seen that as well. And what I find really interesting with that case is a lot of people were messaging me saying, frankly, I don't know which artists came up with this idea first, which kind of comes back to this whole

4:17concept of, you know, it's tough. And I think it's intention. I think it's, I've seen artists that I work with be blatantly copied. And when I know it's blatant is when someone is taking an exact, not just subject matter, but like the way things are laid out on the page, the style, the exact colors. Like there are artists I know who have been ripped off and the paintings are, I mean, we're talking flowers in a vase, the exact same vase, the exact same flowers in the exact same positions.

4:50Like our brains don't work like that. Like you might also be influenced to paint flowers in a expressionistic manner, but that doesn't mean you also thought the daffodil should go on the left. So that's what we're going to get into. And again, this is a very spur of the moment. I don't know how long this episode is going to be, but I just have to get on here to talk

Copycat Art Problem

5:10about it.

Copycat Art Problem

5:10So let's start at the very beginning. Again, I'm not going to name anyone's names. I just would assume artists don't want to be called out here. But a couple of artists I work with as coaching clients, as friends through the gallery, all separate occasions have come to me and they're like, Haley, I am being ripped off. And in one case, it was one artist copying a lot of people, which was interesting. And I just messaged her privately. In another case, it was, you know, just one-off cases. And I first want to start this by saying, I really like to believe the best of intentions

5:43in people. I think these people that are doing this, a lot of them don't know. A lot of the times it's hobbyists. A lot of times it's people that are just getting started. And I'm not going to say that makes it okay, but I do want to get on here. And the reason I posted the videos I posted is because just awareness. I know, and this is so embarrassing for me to say, but when I was in high school and I was painting and I was painting, you know, for my forthcoming dorm room, et cetera, I was totally looking at other artists and being like, oh, this will be fun. I'll paint it. And it wasn't until I really started selling my own artwork, working with interior designers,

6:17realizing, you know, I actually want to make a business out of this, that I was like, I probably should develop my own style and I'm not going to profit off other people's styles. My intuition told me that was wrong, but all's that to say is I'm not perfect. Like, I'm sure I made mistakes. I just didn't have an Instagram until way later. So I want to start there and then kind of talking about how I navigated this issue with a couple of different artists. So first, when an artist came to me, she sent me the photo. She was like, I know this person is copying me.

6:48I was like, yeah, she is. That is like the exact same thing you're doing, the exact same colors, the exact same layout. Like there's no way y'all's brains are that in sync. And I went to this person's page. She had clearly had kind of a pattern of copying artists' work. And of course, it was a lot of artists I knew. So I was like, gosh, you've got to do something about this. But I told her, I was like, we're going to give this girl the benefit of the doubt. She truly might just be young and she was and she might not know. So I, the artist reached out to her. I reached out to her separately. And I just said, you know, I noticed that your work is extremely similar to a lot of artists

7:22that I work with as a gallery owner, as a curator. And I think you should take this script and kind of put your own twist on it as well. And I said, I would, you know, I would just recommend moving forward to really start to develop your own style. I see clearly talent in you, but if you just continue to rip off other artists, you're going to have no reputation and no connections in this art world. And me being a Southerner, like reputation, oh my gosh, throw that word. Like it's crazy. But no, truly, I was just, I tried to come at it from a very positive, positive place.

7:54And I had one artist who, you know, took this approach and the girl was, you know, flustered, embarrassed and apologized profusely and took the post down. I had another scenario where an artist and myself posted something similar and the girl goes, well, I found it on Pinterest. And I sort of had to navigate that, like, that still doesn't make it okay. So this is another thing I want to talk about. I think a lot of people are scared to market their work and they're really scared to market their work on Pinterest, which just, I'm going to say breaks my heart. That's dramatic, but it makes me really sad because it's such a strong marketing platform.

8:25And I will say I market my work extensively on that platform. And yes, there is a risk of people taking your work. There, but what I would say is if they're going to take my work on Pinterest, they could take it anywhere else. And I'm not going to not show my work and not, not make money because of that. Um, but what I will say is I think there is a misunderstanding that like, if art is on Pinterest, it is free to take, which it's not like, just like if our, if something is on Google, you can't just copy it. Like there are rules around that, but again, sharing this, because I think some people don't

8:58know. And so I think that's really important. Um, so navigated that trying to kind of, I told the person and eventually we've moved past it. So I think that artist has, we've cleared that up. I've also been in a couple of situations as a, you know, as a gallery owner, and this I think only happened once or twice, but I had someone reach out to me and question if one of my artists, you know, was replicating her work. She was like, I think her work is too similar to mine. And in that case, it actually wasn't. Um, and this happened a couple of times, so obviously every scenario is different, but in my perspective as an artist, I was like, I actually think you guys are doing similar

9:31lanes of work, but there's too much nuance and differences in these that I really don't think it was copied. Um, and so I've had those conversations as well. And so I respect all elements of this, but I hope this is helpful in kind of helping you start to navigate. If this happens to you, how to approach it. I always think the best first step is to go directly to the person, send them something private. If that doesn't work and they are represented, you can consider going to some, like maybe the gallery that represents them. That doesn't always work, um, but you could try, but I would definitely say start with

10:04them, start private. And then if it, you know, needs to be escalated from there, DM me and I'm happy to help you out. If you love podcasts, you already know how to fit great stories into your busy day. So why not do the same thing with books? Everand is an affordable audio book and ebook subscription that goes wherever you go. Your commute, your workout, your grocery run, no rearranging your schedule, no carving out reading time. Just hit play for a limited time. New members get two free books when they start a free trial. Go to everand.com slash listen to claim yours.

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Viral DIY Video

11:08Uh, second thing I want to talk about though is the particular video that's been going viral. Um, but there's a million of these and they tend to do really well on Instagram, which is disheartening and frustrating. And I even think Instagram almost like promotes it in a way in my, this is totally like conspiracy theory me, but they do particularly well. And I, the reason I think Instagram almost like promotes these DIY videos is because when I posted my copycat video, despite getting so many reshares and so many saves, like if

11:39you guys could see the backend of this video, it really wasn't getting pushed out. And I'm like, Instagram is quieting me. I mean, the video now has like definitely a decent amount of views, but, um, not compared to the backend analytics of like how many people I see saving and resharing it, which is just a sidebar, but the video in question. And again, I'm giving this person the benefit of the doubt. She might be lovely, but she posted a video of specific pieces of like cowboy art, Western art. Um, and she was like, I can't afford these pieces, but luckily like I can create them

12:13myself. And then she kind of steps you, like walks you through how to do it and then shows the finished piece. And it's not, in my opinion, as good as the originals, but where I see this being really problematic is, you know, obviously you're taking another artist style. She actually took pictures of the artist's work. And I, I don't believe credited the artist, which probably was intentional. Um, basically she's like, look how great this art is. I'm going to rip it off. I, that's really how I view it. Um, I, I'm a crafty person. I'm an artistic person.

12:43What you do in your own home. Like if you want to create work for your home, if you want to practice, you want to like, I have a piece from college where I had to copy like a master's painting and I'm not trying to sell it. I, I think I posted a picture of it before, but like, I'm not telling people it's mine. I, I'm always like, this is this other pieces, this, you know, old artist piece of work. So what you do in your own home, I am not going to say is terrible. What I think is bad is when you basically are saying, don't support this artist, like

13:13DIY it yourself or, um, really just profiting off of it in any way. So that's kind of the consumer copying artists problem. And then I want to conclude this podcast talking about the artist copying artists problem. Cause that's what we see the most of like, yeah, there's these viral videos. The artist copying other artists problem is worth worse and like the most prevalent because it's happening every day, constantly. I mean, the amount of new people entering the art world, which I'm such a fan of, like

13:45I love people wanting to become artists. Obviously that is, I've built my career off of working with artists at all levels, you know, with all backgrounds, but it's, you know, I find it very problematic when you're building your business off of someone else's hard work. And it takes years and years and years to find your style. I mean, I developed my two main collections now, which are my figures, the kind of silhouette style. I've been painting figures for years and years and years and years. Didn't land on this style until really like last year, I think.

14:20And then my reading girls were last year. And so, and I've, I'm 30 and I've been painting for, for years and years and years, as I mentioned way back in high school. So I just think it's understanding that just because, because I'm sure people could copy these concepts, but it took me a very long time to get here. Um, and I find that problematic. And so, you know, there's a lot of discourse online right now about, you know, artists and who came up with it first and all of that. And I think in a lot of scenarios, you know, it's very clear who the original artist is

14:54because they're usually the one that's the biggest and they're the one who probably sells it for the most. And then these other people come in and they're newer and they're like, well, I can just do that and I can sell it for less. And obviously that's problematic for a variety of reasons, but you're also building your business on like other people's ideas. And you never really learn to cultivate your own. I think it's hard. I think we live in a world where pictures are everywhere. We see people's work all the time and we see how other people are succeeding. And we're like, why would I take the long, like, why would I play the long game and take

15:25the harder route and wait to find my own voice and my own style when I could just kind of do this thing that's already working, charge a little bit less, make it work for my audience and start selling it today. I understand where you're coming from, but your business is going to be so much worse forward in the long run. And I will say as somebody who navigated and tried to find my style and like, please scroll back to my Instagram, painted so many random things for so long. I have reached more success in my business in the past two years, actually developing deeply my own voice.

15:55And it took me however many years to get here, but I'm finally like very, very successful in my own mind, in my own context, in my own just personal art sales than like more so than ever before. And I think it's because I had that patient outlook. And this is, this is a bigger conversation because I think being an artist takes patience, finding your voice, finding your style, listen to old podcasts on that takes patience. And if you aren't willing to be patient or if you don't have the capacity to be, I mean, I think a lot of people jump into being a full-time artist or really are in a position

16:28where they need it to succeed quickly, that's where I think a lot of this comes up. It's like, well, I want this to work quickly or I need this to work quickly. And so this seems like the fastest path to success. This is actually why I'm a huge proponent as a coach for artists while they're building their businesses, while they're finding their styles, maybe having other sources of income. I, when I was starting, like, I mean, obviously I have other sources of income now because I run the gallery, I do coaching, podcast, et cetera. But even before that, I've worked for interior designers. I've worked for startups. I literally have done so many different things to supplement my income so that I could be

17:03strategic and build a long-term business and figure out my style, figure out my pricing, figure out my voice strategically versus feeling rushed. So that's just a little sidebar, but I think it's really important. So those are just a couple of things I wanted to get into. Emergency episode, because I just think this copycat conversation, it came up so organically and people were talking to me about it and I was like, I should post a video on this. And then since posting that video, you know, there was a lot going on on the internet that I'm sure a lot of you have seen. And so I just wanted to address it.

17:35Frankly, like why I made the video was not, I think some people thought it was like for a certain reason or to call someone specific out. And it, it really wasn't. It was a just multitude of a lot of people I coach coming to me and saying like, Hey, this has happened to me and me trying to just kind of give insight into why it's wrong. But I wanted to get on here to tell you guys a little bit more of the background, why I came up with this, why I wanted to talk about it in a two minute reel. And then, you know, now we're on a 15 minute podcast and just kind of going into more detail.

Artist Copying Artists

18:04So I hope this is really helpful. I promise the podcast is coming back. The plan is for it to come back in August. Um, we'll see how that goes, but if all goes well, that's very much the plan. Um, it'll be a mixture of solos and interviews and all that good stuff with some other stuff possibly thrown in, um, other quick things while we're here that I think are important. Definitely check out the sub stack. If you haven't already so much good stuff over there happening every single week, every single

18:35Thursday, we cover so much good stuff. Club spots are also opening in August, but you can get your name on the wait list now, which I highly recommend, um, because it is kind of a first come first serve basis and spots fill up and all that good stuff. So make sure you get your name on the wait list. And then finally, I'm doing a workshop later this month on the 21st, I believe. Um, and it is on all things financial. So if you have any interest in really growing your business, making more money, making more money from your own style, not copying other people, this is a must listen.

19:07So I, I gave this presentation inside the club to my members that they loved it. And I was like, I need to open this up to more people. So we get into pricing, we get into exactly how I work with one-on-one coaching clients. Like if you had a goal of making $50,000 this year, $100,000 this year, or $10,000 this year, I basically am like, here's how I would work you through getting there based on your numbers now, what you need to know. And like, this is nothing crazy. It's numbers as basic as they come. Like I'm like, can we simplify as much as possible?

19:38So this isn't just another thing on your plate, but it's something that really takes your business to the next level. So highly recommend you sign up for that. I will drop the link in the show notes as well, along with anything else that is relevant, but hope you enjoy this little surprise, um, random episode and the podcast is coming back. So stay tuned for that and I'll talk to you guys soon. Have a great weekend. If you love podcasts, you already know how to fit great stories into your busy day.

20:08So why not do the same thing with books? Everand is an affordable audio book and ebook subscription that goes wherever you go. Your commute, your workout, your grocery run, no rearranging your schedule, no carving out reading time. Just hit play. For a limited time, new members get two free books when they start a free trial. Go to everand.com slash listen to claim yours. That's E-V-E-R-A-N-D dot com slash listen.