BTS is back. But K Pop is not the same.

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Disaster Preparedness

0:41What does it take to be prepared for disaster? You have to be confident. You have to be calm. Will you be perfect? No. But the idea is that you'll have your bearings and this won't be something new to you. This week on Explain It To Me, how to stay ready so you don't have to get ready. New episodes Sundays wherever you get your podcasts. BTS is back.

1:21The K-pop supergroup has been on hiatus for four years. They haven't released an album in six. They were the biggest band in the world. And the question is, can they regain their throne or has the world moved on? Today on the pod is the return of BTS and the future of K-pop.

Introduction to Switched on Pop

1:44Welcome to Switched on Pop. I'm songwriter Charlie Harding. I'm musicologist Nate Sloan. And today to discuss the return of BTS, we have a really exciting special guest. It's Heijin Lee. Heijin, welcome to the show. Hello, hello. Thank you for having me. Welcome. Heijin is my colleague at USC. Heijin is a clinical associate professor of communication at the USC Annenberg School. And I'm going to make everyone jealous right now. Let me tell you the classes that Heijin is currently teaching at USC in the spring semester

2:182026. One is called Crooked Studies of K-pop, Reimagining K-pop's Dominant Discourses Through G-Dragon. If you're not familiar with G-Dragon, one of the... The GOAT. The GOAT, yes. From one of the OG K-pop boy bands, Big Bang. And Heijin is also teaching a class called Promoting Idol in the U.S., where students actually get to have hands-on experience promoting a K-pop group in the United States.

BTS Album Discussion

2:49So, yeah, we're thrilled to have you here, Heijin, because this is a big topic. BTS, first album in six years, and it's getting a lot of positive reviews and maybe some negative ones as well. This album is called Are We Wrong? And we'll talk about what that means in a moment, but I think it's representative of what the New York Times says is the band leaning into the K of K-pop, kind of putting Korean music, tradition, language, and culture at the forefront of this album.

3:22But at the same time, the BBC's Uniku is asking, is BTS losing its K-pop identity as it aims for a bigger world stage? So, it seems like there's this interesting tension. The band is both leaning into its Korean heritage, and at the same time, fans are asking, are they remaining true to their identity? This is a real catch-22. It definitely is.

Song Analysis

3:47I should probably offer a little bit of background. BTS formed in 2010 by Big Hit Entertainment. They became the best-selling group in K-pop history by many metrics. They have seven members. There's RM, J-Hope, and Suga. They're the rappers. And then we've got Jungkook, Jimin, Jin, and V. They went on hiatus four years ago to serve their mandatory military duty in South Korea, and all of them released solo albums as well.

4:20But now they've returned as BTS. They have this new album. They've announced a world tour. Let's listen and hear the tensions that this band is trying to navigate and what it might say about the future of this genre. And I feel like we have to start with the first track off of Ari Rong. It's called Body to Body.

5:10All right, classic BTS in many ways. We've got these heavy hip-hop beats and a in-your-face flow by RM. And then when we get to the chorus, Jin and V take over with a soaring vocal. I mentioned that to some listeners, this album foregrounds Korean music.

5:57But if I fast forward to a little later in this track, we're going to hear a reference to the title of this album. Ari Rong will actually get the folk song of the same name that is associated with Korean history, culture, and identity.

6:27Really striking moment in this opening track.

Ari Rong Song Meaning

6:43And I feel like we need to talk a little bit about this song, Ari Rong, and what it symbolizes. Hey, Jin, what was your reaction when you heard this album title and then heard this interpolation of this Korean folk song in the opening track of the album? Yeah, it's a bold move to use Ari Rong as a framework for the entire album. Because it comes with a lot of expectations that it will have to be very, very Korean. But in this first track, Body to Body, we do hear Ari Rong getting incorporated towards

7:16the end. But it's not just Ari Rong. It's actually a very specific Ari Rong, which is Gyeonggi Ari Rong. Ari Rong actually has very many variations by districts and regions. This one is called Gyeonggi Ari Rong, and it's one of the most well-known Ari Rangs in Korea. But I think there are about 30,000 different versions of Ari Rong. Whoa. This one became the representative of Ari Rong because of a movie that came out in 1926 by Na Eun-kyu called Ari Rong.

7:46And in that movie, this song or this version was featured, and that's how Koreans kind of accepted this as the representative, Ari Rang. But there's one part in the lyrics that kind of like got me going, huh, that's interesting. Like there's a lyric that says, And I thought the use of the term Gyeore was really interesting because it's a pure Korean word for nation or ethnic tribe. Um, so you would translate into like a group of people of the same blood who share same

8:18language, culture, and history for a long period of time. And that's, you know, the moment where we get a sense of what this song is about or how it's kind of like talking about the group leaning into their Korean roots and identities. But I don't think that's really the core message of this song, even though we do hear Arirang towards the end. The part that I thought was really interesting was actually in the pre-chorus, the vocal line singing, which is So that translates into hand-in-hand, so we reach that moon.

8:54So we hear the word hand-in-hand repeatedly. And I didn't really think much about this until I saw BTS appear in like Hot Ones. And then they also mentioned this very briefly, like kind of like a drop and then moving on kind of a thing in the Weverse Life Studio notes that they did on the day the album came out. And Suga mentions the song Hand in Hand being an inspiration of the song. Hand in Hand is the official song for the 1988 Seoul Olympics. It was composed by an Italian songwriter and record producer named Giorgio Moroder.

9:28And the song was performed by a group called Kureyana. Hand in Hand we stand all across the land. And I got curious, like how did the song get chosen as the official song for the 1988 Olympics? And one thing that the Olympics committee wanted to do was to pick a song that the whole world can enjoy. So it kind of opened room or space for a lot of magicians around the world to participate. And Polygram, which is a multinational label, submitted a song.

10:02And of course, that kind of like, you know, raised a lot of disgruntlement within the Korean politicians and those inside the Korean music industry because they wanted to really use the opportunity to showcase Korean talent. And they were kind of upset that a song that was composed by a European would be chosen. But once they listened to the song, they were like, OK, we have to go with this because it was really well made. The original plan was to release the song in English entirely. But then the Seoul Olympics committee, they didn't think it was a good idea. So they made a compromise. So the first verse is in Korean and then the second verse is in English.

10:35And if you if you like play the song, like especially the chorus part, the meaning is the same, but there's a slight variation. Can we listen to the chorus part in Korean first and then in English?

10:50Okay, and here's the English chorus. Did you hear that last part? When they sang Arirang?

11:22Yeah, yeah. So that got included only in the English lyrics. The Korean verse doesn't have Arirang. It ends with hand in hand, but in the English verse, they're like, you know, we got to add Arirang to like, you know, even though the song is being performed in English for the second part, we need to bring some kind of Korean-ness to it. So they they attached Arirang in the lyrics. I thought that was very interesting. But do you get a sense of what the message of the song is? Hand in hand. Well, I'm watching the video of the opening ceremony and I'm seeing all these different

11:57cultures, you know, dancing along and I'm like, okay, this is sort of a sentiment of universalism and we're all we're all the same, you know, even though we're different in many ways. So it seems to be like an anthem of togetherness and harmony, I guess. Like, you know, should be because it's an Olympic theme song, right? It's bringing everybody together. It's about peace, harmony. I mean, that's what the song means by hand in hand. So it's really about coming together. And actually, this is kind of hinted in Body to Body.

12:29So I found that the song isn't really just about Korean ethnicity. And it's not just about focusing on Korean roots and Korean identity. It's about what BTS wants to do with the song, which is about bringing the haters and to kind of like join in on the fun. So these lyrical musical references to both Are We Wrong and Hand to Hand from the 1988 Seoul Olympic Games, they're part of a message of harmony, but they're also bringing up how

13:01this band is facing similar difficulties to, you know, the 1988 Seoul Olympic musicians. How do you navigate both trying to appease your native fans and also have a global reach beyond? I think that same question of Korean identity versus American hegemonic global pop music identity becomes apparent. Can you go back to the chorus, Nick?

13:32It's a great hook. Yeah. I instantly like it. Uh oh. This is a song with a lot of collaborators. The lead songwriter on this track is Ryan Tedder, American hit maker with a global reach. He's kind of like a melody minor.

14:03He can just find these melodies that are kind of familiar, but a little bit different. This song sounds like a top line by Ryan Tedder. I'm just going out on a limb here. And it reminds me so strongly of the Kings of Leon use somebody. If you go to the post-chorus after the probably the biggest chorus.

14:33Now, Nate, you sometimes work as a forensic musicologist on copyright issues. I think we can agree. These are both really small moments of melody that are not exactly the same, but instantaneously, that's what I was hearing when I heard body to body. And in a way, I think brings up that question that you raised at the very beginning of the episode, which is how much are they appealing to Korean roots versus a larger global body? And I think that this song is working somewhere in the middle of that. The idea of even the image of body to body is such a compelling image.

15:05It is both like a romantic song being on someone else's body. It's also the band being close together, their bodies together in a group once again. And it's the bodies of all the people in all the arenas all over the world at their global tour, experiencing that body to body being together. I think we hear that musically as well. The very traditional Korean references and these melodies that might feel a little bit more Americanized. Yeah, these are definitely the benchmarks that fans will use to measure the perceived authenticity

15:36of the album. How many, you know, non-Korean producers are on here. We've also got Diplo joining the ranks for body to body and P-Dog, the group's longtime producer. So there's a mix, just like there's a mix of English and Korean language lyrics here. But yeah, these are the things that have to come into consideration. It continues. We'll come back to this song and its use of Arirang, but this is, you know, a very strong opening statement. Let's see what happens as we move through the rest of the album.

16:08Let's go to the next track on Arirang, which is called Hooligan.

16:18Watch this, watch this, big go, we hooligan. We pop out, we actin' a fool again. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Hooligan. Watch this, watch this, big go, we hooligan. Where there's baseless stuff is so rude. All right, a lot to break down already just in the opening, you know, 30 seconds of this track. First of all, really fun sample to kick things off. This is a really obscure one, which I'm always, you know, excited to encounter.

16:56It's from the soundtrack to a French film from the 1960s called, I'm going to butcher this, Saint-En-Hiver, composed by Michael Magna. I think I found the moment in this track that they're sampling.

17:18And here's Hooligan.

17:25And then as the beat drops, we start to get this like glitching effect here. Maybe a nod to the glitch movement of the late 90s, early 2000s, exemplified by artists like Prefuse 73 and his track, The End of Biters.

18:01And then a sound that I'm going to go out on a limb and say is a sample of knives being sharpened.

18:13Something you'd hear in a lot of trap music, something you'd hear in Megan Thee Stallions, Captain Hook.

18:24Even like Billie Eilish, You Should See Me in the Crown. We hear a lot of knife samples. So I imagine that like it's a wherever you've heard that sound, it brings you back to that place. It's a fun little technique. One thing you have to give BTS a lot of credit for, they wear their influences on their sleeve in the chorus. We have lyrics, why this bass line, slapping so rude, drop it lower than chopped and screwed. We're on way back. Shouldn't it be slowed down rather than sped up?

19:01That whole section is almost like more chipmunk soul than it is chopped and screwed. When they say screwed, they do have a little screw, screw. Because that's the DJ's screw thing. You know what I'm talking about? I know what you're talking about, Charlie. You're splitting hairs and it's warranted. It's warranted. But nevertheless, I feel like the fact that they're calling out some of these influences is significant. We have another producer entering the fold here, El Guincho. If that name sounds familiar, it's probably from his work with Rosalia, especially on her album El Mal Carrere on tracks like Malamente.

19:42So if I have to sum up this heady brew, it's like we're still in classic BTS territory, I think. It's hip-hop forward. It's aggressive. It's creative. It's drawing on a lot of different influences. And I would have to imagine for a lot of longtime ARMY fans, like two tracks in and we're feeling pretty good about the album so far. And there's also this line that you played where RM says, this, that K, gotta get a better pop here.

20:16So even when they're acknowledging that despite all these, like, you know, collaboration with Western songwriters and producers, they're still thinking about the Korean culture, right? We've gotten in trouble before by calling BTS K-pop on the podcast. People in ARMY will say, oh, no, no, this is not K-pop. This is BTS music. It is of its own category. And they are navigating that within the lyrics. I think part of that distinction for a lot of listeners is the fact that BTS are working within the system, but they're also exerting their own opinion.

20:49Hi, I'm Maria Sharapova, host of the Pretty Tough podcast. Each episode, I sit down with high-achieving women to discuss the pursuit of excellence without apology. This week on the show, comedian and best-selling author Chelsea Handler gives her tips on independence and aging gracefully. I would argue that 50, now that I am 50 and I understand life more than I did when I was 30 or 40, is that you get so much more wisdom and you get so much more experience that you actually feel like you're beginning again. Check out Pretty Tough, new episodes on Wednesdays.

21:20You can watch it on YouTube or listen in your favorite podcast app. Okay, so today, we're driving to southern New Jersey and heading to a data center. A couple weeks ago, I read a story in NJ.com, and it was all about how there's a data center going up in Cumberland County, the poorest county in New Jersey, that's receiving some community pushback. And this immediately got my attention, because data centers are going up all across the country. I feel like we should be hearing politicians talk more about this, but we haven't really heard a consensus.

21:56Are data centers really a necessary evil? Let's find out. This is technology we've never seen before. Right. Experiment. We're the experiment down here. And we're the guinea pigs. Right. Exactly. One thing that happens in this country is there's no planning for the future. Is it benefiting people, or is it benefiting the elite and the money that's going into their pockets? This is not about abstract politics. It's about people's everyday lives. That's this week on America Actually.

22:26Why is this still burning inside of me that I feel like I am missing something? I prayed so hard for my girl. I prayed every night. Prayed, prayed, prayed. And when I lost my babies, it was so hard. So that when I had them, I thought that was going to be the thing. Like, I am finally getting the thing that I prayed for, and it's going to fulfill me. And this is everything I want and more. And it was, but it was also something missing.

22:57I'm Raven Arson, and this is Motherhood, the remix from Project Swagger. This series is about defining our own versions of motherhood. I am bringing in a mama I adore and admire. My friend, fellow Peloton instructor Kirsten Ferguson. Listen now at Project Swagger. Minions and control and artistry, you know, perhaps more than other idols in that system.

Aliens Song Analysis

23:26So let's leave that an open question for now. Let's go to the next track on the album, which really continues a lot of the themes we've heard so far. It's called Aliens. So that's J-Hope's pre-chorus, and this particular line caught my ear. Clap and shake it to Jungmori rhythm.

23:56I did some investigating and learned that Jungmori is a traditional Korean rhythm associated with the Pansori tradition. I found some really cool examples of it. I think one I'd love to play is a musician named Kim Young playing this traditional instrument called the A-Jing. And this is an example of that Jungmori rhythm that J-Hope is referencing.

24:45I'm kind of obsessed with this, y'all. I think this might be my next musical deep dive is Kugak, traditional Korean music. I saw this referred to as Korean blues. It's so bluesy and funky, and I love to hear J-Hope shouting it out in the chorus. It's like continuing these themes of traditional Korean culture that we've heard so far. And then as the song continues, we get to the chorus, which leans a little deeper into these themes as well.

25:18For me. From the counter to the high, our love will be one night. Yeah, we A-List. If you wanna hit my house, shim barren bass or not. Yeah, we A-List. Awesome, cute and shameless. Yeah, it'll try to be A-List. Hand on the tongue, chokes on what is it? A-List, A-List. Everything, everything. Everything, everything. From the kanna to the ha.

25:58Hey, Jin, can you break that down for us a little bit? It roughly translates to from A-B to Z. And then I've got a translation for the next line that's, if you wanna hit my house, shoes off at the door, which is a really fun lyric. And then the final lines of the chorus, out of the east, the sun's rising, aliens, aliens. So it seems like there's this kind of reclaiming of this, you know, word that often has a deeply negative association, aliens, invaders, right?

26:30Someone who doesn't belong. But they're reclaiming it, they're saying, no, no, no, we're here, we're repping our country and our traditions proudly, and we're wearing this term alien as a badge of honor. This song probably has the most Korean references out of all tracks in this album. I mean, it is a song that talks about, like, Korean people's, like, lifestyle and traits. Even in that chorus, you know, it talks about, like, the Koreans take off their shoes when they enter, you know, the house. Or Koreans known as people who are polite.

27:02You know, Korea's, like, nickname by China a long time ago was 동방개 위지국, which translates into the eastern nation that's known for its courtesy and etiquette. So that's the reference that we hear in the chorus. And then also the part about Koreans never sleeping because they're always working hard. And Koreans always moving faster. Wodunthalparuge is in the lyrics. So all the stereotypes and traits that we can attach to Korean people seems to be in this very short chorus. In RM's verse later in the song, he leans a little bit deeper into those ideas that you're just discussing.

27:39So the translation I found for the second half of that verse, Pardon Me, Kim-Goo, Tell Me How You Feel. So Kim-Goo is a figure from the Korean independence movement, a freedom fighter against the Japanese when Japan was in control of the nation.

28:17And then the last lines are, you guys with those big eyes say, are they for real? For real. And I think the guys with the big eyes are us. Westerners. Yes. So this track is pulling no punches. It's really a strong statement from beginning to end with lots of lyrical references, like you were saying, to customs and tradition. If I can just kind of go a little bit further with Kim-Goo reference and the lyrics.

28:49Right before when RM says, Pardon Kim-Goo, tell me how you feel. He says, Everybody know now where the K is. So that message of like, you know, finding that K reappears in aliens. And Kim-Goo is, again, as Nate said, is the leader of the Korean independence movement. He was an activist. He was head of state of the provincial government of Republic of Korea. But in 1947, his diary was published. So that would be like two years before he got assassinated. But he's known for giving this quote, and this is roughly translated.

29:23But he said, The only thing that I desire in infinite quality is the power of a highly developed culture. This is because the power of culture both make ourselves happy and gives happiness to others. So back in the day, he's talking about how he hopes Korea can be known for cultural prowess. This was in the 1940s. And when we look back, this was a prediction. So that's what the reference of Kim-Goo Sung-Sung is in the song. One more track I want to listen to from the first half of this album is called Fire.

29:53And it reaches into its 90s house bag. Everything lit is fire. Everything big is fire. Everything lit is fire. Everything big is fire. She want to dance on fire. Everything gas is fire. No one's standing too close, too close, too far. Give me that gasoline. Give me that make me faint. Give me that make me sweat. Something I can't forget. Burned out with my slime. We ain't a flinged one.

30:24It's 200 degrees. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Club goes psycho. Might take you by hoe. I go through the night. Once again, bringing in some really creative producers. JPEG, Mafia, and Flume both appear here. I should probably mention back when we were listening to Aliens, that was a Mike Will Made It production. What a creative cast of collaborators they're bringing in. And yeah, this track slaps. Forgive me, Charlie. I know you hate when I say that, but I have no other adjective to prescribe here.

30:58It's so much fun to listen to. It's got that 90s house beat. It's got these electric lyrics. I feel like everything we've heard so far from the opening four tracks of this album is just like guns blazing out of the gate, wearing the K of K-pop on their sleeves. And then something kind of shifts in the album.

Album Shift

31:20Track seven is simply called number 29. And it's short. You're looking at this and you're like, oh, you know, sometimes in the past, BTS will do like a skit or an interlude or something. Maybe that's what we're going to get here. But instead, press play on the song number 29. And this is what you hear.

31:40Sound bath. What? It is one minute and 38 seconds of that bell hit that we just heard and then the natural decay of the sound until it's completely disappeared. This is a field recording of the bell of King Sonduk, the 29th national treasure of Korea, a bell that was cast in the year A.D. 771.

32:12So it's like literally millennia's old. And it was only rung for the first time in centuries, like 22 years ago. So it's not a sound you get to hear very often, much less in the middle of a BTS album. It's the sonic palate cleanser, isn't it? It's a palate cleanser. It's another reference to Korean heritage. And it kind of signals a transitional moment in the album. If the opening tracks have all been mainly hip hop in style, after this bell ring, we're going to move more into the world of pop and ballads and melody forward songs, including the biggest hit in the lead single from this album, Swim.

33:02Swim, swim, water falling off your skin Swim, swim, I could spend a lifetime watching you Swim, swim, this is how it all begins to swim Like a lot of contemporary pop songs, it starts with the chorus, here sung by Jungkook and Jimin. And unlike anything we've heard so far, this song is entirely in English. Also, those Korean references that we've been detecting throughout, I'm not sure we're going to get any here.

33:38This is a different side of BTS and maybe one that is reaching more for that Western global market. It feels almost like a chorus by The Weeknd. Dark, melancholy, melodic, you know, nods to hip hop and R&B, but really slow. I had a similar reaction, maybe more leaning towards Frank Ocean, who has a song called Swim Good. I mean, BTS have excellent taste.

34:14Something that is exemplified by the producer they bring in for the next track, Merry Go Round. I'll play this one, and then Charlie will put you to the test and see if you can name the ringer they brought in for Merry Go Round. I have not looked it up. I'm coming in. No knowledge. I can't get on this merry-go-round. It spins me around. Sometimes when you bring me something, the less I know, the better.

35:00That's Kevin Parker of Tame Impala. Oh, that was good, Chuck. I'm going to play New Person, Same Old Mistakes by Tame Impala. Kevin Parker is indeed the producer on Merry Go Round. Feel like a brand new bus. But you're in the same old mistakes. Can't let it all be in the last time for it's too late. Feel like a brand new bus. Fuzzy synths, lo-fi guitar, analog keyboards that have been out of tune for 40 years.

35:35A lot of tape hiss and wobble. That's that sound. Another all-star producer, slightly out of left field. Another song entirely in English that doesn't have any of those Korean hallmarks we heard in the first half of the album. What about the next track, Normal?

35:58Fantasy and fame, yeah, the things we chose. Show me hey, show me love, make me bulletproof. Yeah, we call this shit no more. Run away, I was like, don't know what I want. That's got to be another Ryan Tedder song. Am I right?

36:17Let's see. I got to check my notes here. Yes. Yes. That's a Ryan Tedder song. Okay. Okay. He's hot. He's heating up, as they say in NBA Jam. I mean, this song is continuing the theme we've heard so far in the sense that English language lyrics more just sort of garden variety pop themes rather than like specifically Korean. In other ways, though, the song does connect to the deeper history of BTS who have always been unafraid to, you know, comment on their interiority, what they're experiencing in the world in a way that is maybe distinct from other K-pop artists.

36:57It's kind of like we were talking about earlier, like this song to me is clearly about the pressures of being one of the most famous bands in the world. Show me hate, show me love, make me bulletproof. And probably bulletproof is a reference to their original name, which was the bulletproof Boy Scouts. And then they say, we call this shit normal, but it's not. And they've publicly grappled with these issues in the lead up to this album, sort of maybe coming out and being a little too honest, some of the members about their struggles with their notoriety and then having to sort of walk back and apologize for those outbursts.

37:39So I feel like this is a song, despite its pop sheen, that maybe allows the group to also express itself a little more openly. I mean, the song is about duality, right? And BTS has always explored that concept, like, you know, going all the way back to Idol. You know, they talk about, they call me artist, they call me Idol. Arham has done that with his mixtape called Mono. It's full of contradictions and how he tries to navigate between love, hate, like sun, moon, all these like words that are in the lyrics. That talk about the contradictions.

38:10Suga did that with Techita, where he's playing the king and also the wanderer. At the end of the music video, the wanderer character ends up killing the king. So it's full of like, you know, these messages of working with duality and then also like their acceptance of being both instead of rejecting one over the other. I was listening to one of their first songs, No More Dream. And a lot of that song is about sort of breaking out of the conformity of society and not being afraid to dream.

38:44Like in verse one, they rap about the completely forgotten childhood that was filled with so many dreams. And you hear the bell.

39:20The class bell, right? As he said, OK, I'm going to the study room right now. I mean, fast forward 13 years and they've achieved those dreams. But in this song, you know, maybe it's not all it's cracked up to be. Normal, I mean. Wow. Let's listen to one more track from the back half of this album. It's called They Don't Know About Us. And it's got a great intro. I was convinced that was a sample, but I don't think it is.

40:01I think that's a BTS original recorded in the style of acapella group like The Four Freshmen. It's a blue world without you. What follows is maybe the one track in the back half of this album that returns to some of the themes the group explored in the first half.

40:34The Korean-ness of their background. Background. Background. I can show you love. I can show you. If you want to know me working out the fire. I can't tell you what you want to tell me. I'm not going to tell you what you want to tell me. I can't tell you what you want to tell me. I can't tell you what you want to tell me. I don't know. Everybody heard their story that they wanted. I don't know. You're a nigga, I'm a nigga, I'm a nigga. We're just big boys. I got you on them. So, hey, Jin. We just heard this line, we're just big boys, a.k.a. country kids.

41:10Chon-no. Chon-no. Yeah. And this is a word that appears in BTS' songs quite frequently. And this is how BTS identify themselves. And I think what's interesting is by using this term, that they're able to continue their underdog narrative, which has been a big part of BTS' rise, right? And in the beginning, you know, BTS always talked about how they're not from the big three. Back then, it was, you know, SM, JYP, and YG Entertainment.

41:40And Big Head was just a small company. And BTS was from that small company. So, they didn't get as many opportunities to perform on TV shows and stuff like that. So, that's why they started using social media to communicate with fans and how they got the global recognition and popularity. So, the underdog narrative has always been crucial to BTS' identity. And Chon-noom is a word that seems to symbolize that. It really roughly, you know, translates into country kids. But what's interesting is it doesn't just appear in the song, in the documentary. I don't know if you saw BTS' The Return.

42:12Like, we see RM talking where he's inside the car. And he says something about, like, how one of the things that we need to hold on to is, at our core, we're still just a bunch of country kids from Korea. So, what's interesting is that, in the beginning, they were underdogs. And that was because they're hip-hop idol groups. And they're from this small company. So, that was kind of like, you know, attached to the industry framework. But now that they've become this global superstar, it's their Korean-ness, their Asian-ness that makes them the underdog.

42:43So, we do see how they're still holding on to the underdog narrative. But the target is a bit shifted. And the word Chon-noom reflects their underdog identity. And this is another thing that I want to point out is that BTS is not just seven members from Korea. None of the members are from Seoul, which is the capital of Korea. And that's also a big part of BTS positioning themselves as underdogs. Like, in Korea, like, you know, everything centers around Seoul. So, if you're not from the capital of the country, you're kind of considered to be, like, less sophisticated or not part of the mainstream.

43:19So, like, seven members not being from the city of Seoul also allows BTS to kind of position themselves as Chon-noom or as the underdogs. And this is really highlighted in their earlier song called Paltokangsan or AKA Satoori Rap, which was, I think it was in their first mini album, Oh, Are You Late Too?, which was released in 2013. And we see the members doing rap, but using Satoori or dialect from different regions or from the parts of the country that they're from. It's a really fun song if we can play it and listen to it a bit.

43:52That's a good song. That's fun. Yeah, it's a real... That kicks ass. And what's so funny about the song is we hear, like, the, you know, like, Suga, who's from Daegu, and J-Hook, who's from Gwangju, like, you know, kind of get interacting in their own dialects. And then RM, who's from Irsan, which is close to Seoul, but not quite.

44:24It will be kind of like, you know, like Orange County to LA kind of a thing. But he's representing Seoul. So that's why he says Seoul's state of mind in that part of the lyrics, you know. And he calls the other members who are from different regions, Chon-num-들. You hear that in the lyrics. Yeah. So again, that's what Chon-num means. Like, it's their state of mind of being like the underdogs that they still seem to carry. Getting a little bit of that history from just, you know, a single line in They Don't Know About Us brings us back to the question we were posing at the beginning of this.

45:00How is BTS positioning themselves, re-emerging from this hiatus? When they went on hiatus, the effect on the K-pop industry at large was so profound that, according to one study, Korean album sales dropped almost 20%. So the world that BTS is re-emerging into is different. Is there a new Korean act that is ready to take the mantle from them?

45:32It's unclear. Now, their tour, which is the first since 2019, has already sold out globally. These songs are on the Billboard Hot 100. I think despite some of the criticisms or disappointments that longtime fans might feel, this album is hugely successful. But will they be able to put the country, the soft power of the Korean wave on their backs once again? We'll see. I know the focus has mostly been on, like, the Korean roots and culture and heritage and all that.

46:07But in the documentary, there's a discussion of what Arirang means or how the members are processing the meaning. And one of the terms that gets mentioned is legacy in motion. So, and, you know, Arirang is powerful, not because it represents Korean people's sentiment and feeling. You know, the song first, we don't even know the origin, like, when it first started or who came up with it. But, you know, we still sing it. So it's the passage of the song from one generation to the next. And I think that's how BTS is thinking about the meaning of Arirang.

46:41Not necessarily the cultural, you know, connection, but the survival of the song. And they want to create Arirang with this album. They want their songs to be, you know, something that they can consider as part of their legacy. That people can sing along to, like, in years to come. And I think that's the real meaning of Arirang, if you think about it. Not just about the Korean-ness, not just about the Korean roots and heritage and identity. But about where it fits in their legacy now that they're no longer these, like, teen boy bands.

47:12They're, you know, they're in their 30s and they're thinking about the next step. Building on what Hyejin just said, there's a really cool story that I learned. Actually, a bit of music history that was totally new to me. In 1896, seven Korean students traveled to the United States to study in Washington, D.C. at Howard University. There's already a lot of parallels to BTS here with their seven members making, you know, their way overseas over a century later. A group of these students made a recording on a wax cylinder at the Library of Congress that was taken by a folklorist named Alice Cunningham Fletcher.

47:53And that wax cylinder is the first recording anywhere, including in Korea, of this song, Arirang. So hats off to BTS for uncovering this incredible bit of cross-cultural music history. Well, and most importantly, to say thank you for joining us. It's been really a pleasure, all your expertise.

48:25Thank you for giving me the opportunity to participate. Switched on Pop is produced by Rihanna Cruz, edited by Lissa Soap, engineered by Brandon McFarlane, illustrations by Iris Gottlieb, video by Nick Ripps, music by Jossie Adams, and Zach Tenario of Arc Iris. Remember, the Vox Media podcast Network and Vulture, which is part of New York Mag. You can subscribe at nymag.com slash pod. Reach out to us on social media at Switched on Pop. Tell us what else you're hearing on Arirang. Any references we missed, any use of traditional Korean instruments, because, like I said, this is my new obsession.

48:59We'll be back with a brand new episode next week. A crossover episode. A crossover episode. That's exciting. Until then, thanks for listening. Thanks for listening. Thanks for listening.

49:20Thanks for listening.