Empress Matilda: Civil War and the Fight for the Throne

Introduction

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Peyroni's Disease

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1:19equivalent to 15 dollars per month new customer offer for first three months only then full price plan options available taxes and fees extra see mint mobile for details let's talk about a condition many people haven't heard of and it turns out it's more common than you'd think peyroni's disease or pd for short pd can happen when scar tissue builds up under the skin of the penis this can cause a curve with a bump during an erection and for some men lead to pain during intimacy and may impact mental health it may also lead to anger and frustration depression lower self-esteem and even withdrawal from

1:55sexual activity and physical intimacy because of this some men could feel embarrassed or reluctant to talk about pd the actual cause of pd isn't always known in some cases it may be linked to a minor injury or repeated injuries during sex or other physical activity the good news is pd is treatable if you notice a curve with a bump a trusted urology specialist can help diagnose it and walk you through your options including non-surgical treatment to learn more about peyroni's disease visit talkaboutpd.com

Medieval England

2:27hello everyone and welcome to the rest is history and welcome to saint bartholomew the great which is london's oldest medieval church and a very appropriate setting for what is a new mini-series for club members as a massive treat and because on the rest is history we are all heart we are making this first episode free if you like it and you would like to see the next two then you know

3:03what you've got to do it's an appropriate setting because the theme of this mini-series is the real life cersei lannisters the she-wolves of medieval england and with me to talk about the she-wolves is the author of a book called she-wolves it's my dear friend and erstwhile colleague helen castor helen welcome to the rest is history thank you for having me before we go to the middle ages should

16th Century Queens

3:31we just look at the century that follows the medieval period the 16th century because there are a lot of queens in the 16th century and what perspective do all those queens kind of shed on the time that we're going to be talking about today in the series it's interesting isn't it because it goes in two directions in one sense we tend to assume i think that because there are all these queens in the 16th century so should we just list them so um elizabeth the first mary queen of scots mary tudor there's also there's this extraordinary moment in the 1550s where there seemed to be women

4:07everywhere a monstrous regiment a monstrous regiment of women although nox doesn't quite mean that we'll come to that mary of hungary has been ruling the netherlands for her called mary they're all mary's for her brother the holy roman emperor charles v mary queen of scots is the queen of scotland living in paris while her mother mary of guise is regent in scotland for her then we have mary tudor in england they're all mary's they're all catholic and in geneva john knox a fulminating

4:38calvinist scot with a big beard is extremely cross about all this so he writes the first blast of the trumpet against the monstrous regiment of women saying monstrous regiment is not it's not like a kind of military parade of queens kind of marching it's easy to see isn't it this dreadful battalion of mary's no regiment means regimen rule and monstrous means unnatural abominable so what he's talking about is the monstrous rule of women which he thinks shouldn't be allowed his timing is terrible

5:14he publishes this in the summer of 1558 a few months later protestant elizabeth becomes queen in england she's not impressed and he's left he's left saying i didn't mean you but she never forgives him quite rightly but we tend to assume that if this argument is going on in the 16th century that women are beginning to rule but there's a big pushback that this must be progress because we tend to think of the middle ages as sort of benighted things were obviously worse then less

5:47woke in the middle ages but it's not necessarily true the point being that in the middle of the 16th century it's really the accident of the hereditary system that's thrown all these women into the century it's famous inability to father a son until he does and then the son dies and he's just got these two daughters that's right but also his great skill at killing anyone else on the family tree who might have a better claim than the tudors so he's killed lots of potential male heirs and only been left with these two daughters but the hereditary principle could have thrown up women at any point

6:22in the centuries before and in fact it had done back in the 12th century so should we go to that yes

Matilda and Henry

6:29should we look at matilda and i've said that we we're in london's oldest parish church and this was originally part of a priory that was founded in the reign of henry the first by henry the first jester and henry the first is the son of william the conqueror so we're going right the way back you know a very very long way and matilda is the daughter of henry the first isn't she she is the granddaughter of the conqueror and what we need to understand about this moment in english history is that really all bets are off about what the system of succession is going to be there hasn't

7:08actually been yet by the time we get to henry the first and matilda there hasn't yet been a straightforward succession since the conqueror the conqueror himself was illegitimate his parents hadn't been married he does get married and has sons but he's succeeded by william rufus who's his second son even though his oldest son robert kurt hose as he's known robert short legs robert fat legs as depending how rude you want to get he's the eldest son but he's not the one who ends up

7:42inheriting and there has to be he inherits england doesn't he and robert inherits normandy in theory complication in theory you're absolutely right we're dealing not only with a new system in england but a new political entity the anglo-norman realm which is two different parts it's the duchy of normandy and the kingdom of england william tries to split them up he's already promised normandy to his oldest son who he's gone off since doing that but he really wants rufus to inherit and rufus fights robert

8:15and gets the whole lot but in the new forest august 1100 an arrow goes astray william rufus gets speared in the heart robert the older brother is still alive but henry the younger brother is the one who's there seizes his moment he jumps on his horse looking at the prone body of his brother shot by an arrow in the new forest and rushes to westminster to get himself crowned and rushes to winchester to take

8:46control of the royal treasury so he's king by a coup really rather than by i'm the eldest i should can i ask because you say he's crowned but he's also anointed and there's a kind of dare i say sacral dimension to that that once he's been anointed i mean you can't really wash off the balm that's it and that's what makes a king at this point it is as you say it's it's a quasi sacrament kingship takes

9:17effect in that holy moment we tend to say crowned but you're quite right to point at the moment when the holy oil touches the head the breast that is when a king becomes a king and henry is incredibly able and he marries into the old anglo-saxon royal dynasty so he has gained himself legitimacy in that way he has legitimacy in all sorts of ways he also he's also very keen to point out that he was born in the purple that is he was born after william the conqueror became king of

9:48england he's married matilda of scotland the daughter of saint margaret of scotland who's descended from the anglo-saxon royal house you've got a saint as your mother-in-law i mean that's pretty good isn't it it is so he's a very able king and he does what kings are meant to do which is to father children and in particular a son so just talk us tell us about his children henry is an interesting character he has many many many children he has at least 20 illegitimate children although one of his

10:19fans among the chroniclers says with a completely straight face that this was not a question of lust this was a question of um i can't remember quite what it was a question of but something very holy

Role of Queens

10:31and kingly but he only has two legitimate children he has a son william and a daughter matilda and he's got big plans for both of them so william is called william atheling and atheling is the old english word for someone who is worthy to succeed to the throne and it's it's it's a purely masculine signifier a female equivalent there is not and you can see why when you look at the great seal of the new norman kings of england because the two central roles of kingship are depicted there on one side

11:07you have a king sitting on a throne with the symbols of kingship an orb sometimes a sword sometimes a scepter this is a king as lawgiver as judge and on the other side you have a king in armor on a horse with a sword in his hand king as warrior those are the two central functions and neither of them is something that a woman can do so let's come to so we've got um the atheling william let's come to matilda the daughter so what role does henry see her fulfilling a huge dynastic role because he secures

11:40for her the grandest possible husband in europe at the age of eight she is sent off to germany to marry the holy roman emperor henry v so she becomes empress she does she is not actually eventually crowned by the pope but she is crowned in saint peter's in rome by a bishop of course that's good enough isn't it it's good enough for herself empress for the rest of her life she's married to the emperor she has been crowned in saint peter's i mean this is an extraordinary destiny if you imagine

12:13being an eight-year-old girl sent off across europe to a country where you don't speak the language you're marrying a man 16 years older than you it's a big ask it's a huge ask and she makes a tremendous success of it she is known in germany thereafter as the good matilda by the age of 16 she has the confidence of her husband to such an extent that he leaves her behind in italy as his regent when he is called back to germany she is extraordinarily able and she takes on this job to which she's been

12:51sent when she's a child with such aplomb and such ability so what that suggests is that um although queens aren't expected to fight or to deliver judgment they do definitely have a role to play they do they can represent the men to whom they are related to whom they are supposed to be a supplemental figure and i mean supplemental in two ways that is they must acknowledge male authority

13:21but they can supplement it they can represent it when it is unquestionable that they have the right to do so so matilda as the emperor's wife can represent him when he's not there but they must do so in a way that um accords with what it is to be a good woman so i've said we're in saint bartholomew the great this is the place where the virgin mary made her only recorded appearance in

13:51london and i'm wondering does the model of the virgin in medieval europe the virgin you know you can pray to the virgin to intercede with her son christ is there an element of that that influences the role of the queen that she can intercede for people with her husband the king certainly she uh must be a peacemaker an intercessor she can represent his authority and impose his authority but she must never

Virgin Mary Model

14:21challenge it because as saint paul tells us in the first letter to the corinthians um christ is the head of man man is the head of woman and god is the head of christ so there is an order of creation here in which women must acknowledge male authority and as the virgin does can can intercede can make peace but challenge must not step outside that that virtuous role a good woman wouldn't step outside

14:53that role and therefore a woman who does step outside that role cannot be good yeah so henry the first he's in england he's looking very proudly at his two children he's got william atheling you know he's great he's going to be a great king uh he's got matilda who's off in the empire doing her thing you know behaving like a queen should all look splendid and then there's a disaster isn't it and it it involves um we've been doing the lusitania we've done the titanic this is another ship that sinks and this is called the white ship we're in november 1120 henry and his son william atheling

15:29are crossing from normandy or are about to cross from normandy to england this is a crossing that they do regularly you have to do it if you're ruling both normandy and england compared to matilda who's been crossing the alps to get from germany to italy one modern historian says that crossing the channel really was a matter of complete convenience compared to crossing the alps in the middle ages but something's gone wrong with the plan on this particular dark night in november and it's the fact

16:03that william atheling all his friends and everyone on board the ship he's traveling in is roaring drunk yeah it's just a massive stag dude it is he's on tour exactly they crash into a rock or whatever and they decide they're going to race the king's ship and they don't see the rock in barfleur harbour the ship goes down with all hands except we're told a butcher from rouen who has got on board to try and get the aristocrats to pay the debts they owe him and because he's wearing sheepskin

16:33not silks and furs he manages to cling on to a spa to tell someone what's happened so this is terrible news for henry because awful news who's going to succeed him all he's got left of his legitimate children he has all these illegitimate children but by now we're in we're a couple of decades into the 12th century and the church is beginning to get quite fierce william the conqueror was a bastard you said exactly but things have moved on things have moved on two things have moved on particularly the church um is beginning to get quite fierce about the sacrament of marriage and cracking down

17:07on the idea of legitimate birth but the other is that henry the first is a classic poacher turned gamekeeper don't do as i did do as i say and what he says is that his bloodline his legitimate bloodline must succeed but the problem he's left with is he's only got a daughter left how does he try and

Henry's Succession

17:28finesse things so that his daughter can succeed him it's a multi-pronged plan the first is he gets married again immediately he's a widower by this stage but he marries a very young woman called adelisa revue van and it takes her with him everywhere so his plan a is he's going to have more sons doesn't actually happen but that's his plan a plan b is his daughter uh matilda is going to be his safety net and particularly after 1125 because five years of this second

18:03marriage no baby sons have appeared yet but matilda's husband the holy roman emperor dies he dies very young and he and matilda have not had any children so she can now come back she can now come back she is summoned back immediately and henry has two plans for her the first is that all of his nobles must immediately swear allegiance to matilda as his heir which and this is the interesting thing henry the eighth could have taken note of this they immediately line up to do nobody says

18:34nobody puts on a big beard and says like john knox it is an atrocious idea that you know an abomination right so it's not it's there's no kind of rule that says that a woman can't succeed there are no rules at all i mean the fact that the conqueror has been succeeded by his two younger sons while his oldest son is still alive the conqueror was bastard born rules are not really there at all let alone set in stone in this world so henry is creating rules around him he gets all his nobles to line up and

19:07swear allegiance to matilda and the only argument that breaks out is about who should have the honor of swearing first there's an argument between his uh illegitimate son robert earl of gloucester and his favorite nephew stephen count of mortain about who's going to have the honor of kneeling to swear allegiance to matilda so so far so good henry's still hoping to have more sons his nobles have sworn allegiance to matilda and his plan c or perhaps could become a plan b is that

19:41he's going to marry matilda off again and perhaps she can have sons so that he could be succeeded by a grandson and is there someone suitable to marry perhaps from the it turns out there is anjou which is normandy's next door neighbor historic adversary and rival but there is a young heir to the county of anjou called jeffrey so poor old matilda having been married off at eight to a 24 year old she's now 26 being married off to a 15 year old the heir to the county of anjou jeffrey and there's something

20:17to do with a sprig of yes the badge of the house of anjou the plantagenista if you're looking for the beginnings of the plantagenet so this is we might be getting it here so there's a little clue there as might be so matilda is married to to to this guy very unhappily um but they have you know they they clearly have children they do the job in the end i mean matilda kicks up a fuss she gets married to him but within a year she's back with her dad saying dad do i really have to do this

20:47but she has a little baby boy and she calls him henry she does he a really red-headed so little baby henry plantagenet baby henry and we may be hearing more of him today and in our next episode we may okay so that's the state of play when henry the first dies it is he dies what happens then he dies very suddenly because he he has a surfeit doesn't he he has a surfeit of lampreys because this is an occupational hazard of being a medieval king is that you you have surfeits and die you do i mean you'd have to pay me to have even one lamprey i think let alone a surfeit of them but the horrible

21:22eel like fish but anyway yes he he suddenly takes ill and dies in december 1135 he is in his 60s but he's a bull of a man so this is a shock he's been bestriding the anglo-norman realm for he seems a terrifying man he really really was i think but matilda to whom the nobles of england and normandy have sworn allegiance more than once by this stage is i mean i think often the chroniclers and modern historians don't take so seriously the reality of female experience we're so used to

22:00thinking about warfare the dangers of warfare and so on but the problem for matilda in december 1135 is she's had little baby henry in 1133 she then had little baby jeffrey in 1134 and nearly died having him i mean really seriously nearly died in the autumn of 1135 she's pregnant again she's in the very early stages of pregnancy and another occupational hazard for medieval women her husband

22:30and her father have fallen out so she's in anjou with her husband in the very early stages ready to be anointed she is not in the right place at the right time and she's going to struggle to get there because she's pregnant she's not been well she gets a certain way she gets into normandy just into normandy but that's still a long way from the coronation chair i suppose to apply the

Stephen's Claim

22:57masculine perspective a woman never looks from the male point of view less suited to playing the masculine role of a king than when she's pregnant that's exactly it and married of course to the count of anjou who the anglo-norman baronage are used to thinking of as an enemy yeah so all in all so it's all tricky so i suppose in in a situation like that where the the pregnant queen um is not in england there are opportunities for someone to do a henry the first and rush off and go to england and get

23:33yourself anointed and become the king in situ and is that what happens one man among the anglo-norman barons has been paying very close attention to the lessons of history which i know is what we all think everyone ought to be doing all the time the rest of the barons are accompanying henry's body very slowly back from normandy to england and they're having meetings about who could become king because obviously we don't really want the pregnant woman and they come up with this idea that henry the first nephew

24:04theobald of blois one of their number might be a good idea i mean you can't i mean all due respect to um to theo our producer but you can't have someone called theo as king of you can't can you i mean but that is a rule i think but theobald has a younger brother called stephen who's married to the heiress to boulogne which is very handy for getting to england he has paid attention to what his uncle did when he became king he jumps on his horse gets to the coast gets on a ship jumps back on a horse

24:35gets himself to winchester takes control of the royal treasury and then has himself crowned and anointed before anyone else knows what's happening so the sacred oil has seeped into his skin and he is now impregnated he is impregnated kind of sacramental oil with kingship yeah and so at this point you have two different kinds of royal legitimacy standing in opposition to one another because you have the hereditary principle vested in matilda she's been named his heir by the previous

25:09king and all the barons have sworn allegiance to her i suppose some of them have a kind of personal loyalty to henry and therefore to his daughter absolutely they do even though she's this weaker vessel she's the wrong sex but yes henry has designated her his heir and she does have sons so the bloodline will continue through matilda but on the other hand you have stephen who isn't even the oldest son in his own family his older brother is still alive but he has been crowned and anointed he now is a king whether you like it or not so i suppose one one solution might be that that she

25:45stays in normandy and becomes the kind of the duchess of normandy or whatever and stephen stays in england but that's not really possible is it because all the the barons and so like they have they have lands in both normandy and england and so they do need someone who can kind of preside over both realms they do they need uh a king uh duke in normandy but they need someone who can provide them with order with justice leadership in war we also have to remember this is a time when um

26:15frontiers between states are exactly that they're frontiers if you are not defending your frontiers someone else is going to pour over them with their army so the idea that you could just leave your lands in normandy for someone else to look after is not so this is a real problem then i mean what happens how do they resolve this problem initially it looks as though stephen has won that kind of decisive seizing the moment and the fact that he he's not only been anointed as a king but he looks like he can do

26:49the job he is a man he can lead in war he can offer justice this is what the chroniclers tell us at this point he takes the throne because he can bring peace he can bring justice he fits the job and so for the first year or so it looks as though there's a sort of virtuous circle operating in his favor poor old matilda is off in a castle in the south of normandy having given birth to her third son and such bad timing but her husband is trying to push into normandy to try and stake her claim there

27:26but it looks as though england is lost even robert earl of gloucester matilda's illegitimate half brother who's held out for a while trying to resist the idea that stephen is this irresistible force he gives in at easter 11 36 and it looks as though stephen's got it all but it's not long before it starts going wrong so is this a reflection of the fact that we haven't really talked about matilda's character up up till now is she a very kind of obdurate woman a determined woman someone who's not prepared to let this matilda is not going to let her inheritance go she won't let it go for her

28:02own sake she is the daughter of henry the first baby henry but she is the mother of sons she's had to marry hair and his little red face she's had to marry this plantagenet youngster that she didn't want to have anything to do with but she's done it in order to get these sons and she is not going to let their inheritance go it's quite hard to get a sense of the detail of matilda's character with all these women the chroniclers don't really give us clearly thumbnail sketches in the same way she

28:32is very very tough even though i mean it's really interesting if you read the chronicles they're almost trying not to mention her there are two chronicles at this point the guest of stefani which is the deeds of steven so we know who the hero is there he tries not to mention he says the countess of anjou or the or the the earl of gloucester's sister he doesn't really want to let her certainly not calling her the empress exactly whereas william of malmesbury who's much more sympathetic his hero is robert of gloucester her half-brother so we get glimpses of matilda around the edges but every glimpse we get shows us how

29:09tough she is right so you can judge her by her actions and her actions essentially are to aim not just to secure normandy but to claim the throne of england by 1139 so we are four years into steven's reign now it is clear that steven is struggling to get any kind of foothold in normandy matilda and jeffrey are doing well there and that's going to be a structural problem for him because if he can only claim half the anglo-norman realm he's going to struggle to get all the barons to follow him but

29:42matilda in 1139 does the key thing she gets herself to england because that's where she's going to stay so how does she get a foothold there it's a brave move so i mean we can say she's brave as well we can say she's very brave she and robert of gloucester her half-brother take ship for england and they land they don't hit a rock they don't hit a rock first first victory she's done better than her brother already she lands at arundel in sussex and this is very canny because they've only got a small bodyguard

30:15with them but arundel castle is held by matilda's widowed stepmother adelisa of louvain who's the same age as her this young woman that her father had married after her brother died adelisa's remarried but matilda and adelisa do know each other of old they seem to have a lot of respect for each other and adelisa lets matilda into the castle robert of gloucester spirits himself away to his stronghold in bristol but stephen has now got a problem matilda's in the country she's in a castle with

30:49the ex-queen the queen dowager is he going to besiege them is he going to try to capture them what's that going to look like here's a moment where being a woman can actually help you if she was a man then all bets are off it's war but she's a woman is stephen really going to besiege kind of hint of chivalry absolutely stephen is not going to do his image as king any good if he is seen to be treating two royal women without due deference without due respect so it's a little bit

31:25like in the series we did on 1970s britain harold wilson wondering how he was going to deal with margaret thatcher at prime minister's question time you know that's in a very vague that's not a bad analogy and one of the criticisms that is leveled at stephen is that he's too nice he struggles to land the killer blow he's good i mean he's next to the throne i mean he's not he's no he's good at that kind of decisive action but when it comes to the iron fist to capturing and killing women capturing killing women even capturing and killing some of his male opponents

31:59the killer blow okay sometimes so this is the lesson of history don't be weak if you're a medieval king exactly um so essentially the consequence of this is that civil war breaks out and this is

The Anarchy

32:12what comes to be called the anarchy the time when christ and his saints slept and it rages and rages um and this was always my favorite period when i was a child in studying medieval history because it's where the terrible tortures come in because the um the barons would steal wayfarers and they would put knotted ropes around their heads and slowly tighten them until they handed over their money or they would put cages with rats on the stomach and the rats would gnaw

32:45through the stomach until again until they revealed where their money was and so this for me as a child was the single most interesting thing about uh the anarchy you were doing horrible histories before horrible histories existed absolutely but i'm suspecting that you were going to have a slightly different perspective on this and that there are actually more interesting things to say about the anarchy than the rats on the stomach i i'm not sure there are more interesting things in a way on a par with the rats and actually it's a really good point because it shows us why you need a king of course because people going around putting rats on people's stomach exactly and that's what the

33:20barons will do if left to their own devices and they will do it not just because they are aiming for power by any means necessary but they're also trying to defend themselves this is always the problem if you're a medieval baron yes you can go around putting rats on people's stomachs but if a bigger baron comes along what's he going to do it to you so this is why anarchy is terrifying so that's bad and the other famous thing that happens in the anarchy is um people rushing around in snow wearing um night dresses so what's going on with that we will get to that because that's one again one of

33:54matilda's very bravest moments even her enemies grudgingly admit that she's brave at that point but this is to do with the key really the the pivotal part of the anarchy because it is 19 years of of slugging at each other chaotic civil war but the pivotal point is 1140 1141 so it comes pretty quickly after matilda has arrived in england robert of gloucester by now is her champion he's her general

34:26she can't fight in a battle but robert of gloucester is going to lead there's never any thought of that that she could ride out in the kind of you know queen elizabeth at tilbury style but even queen elizabeth at tilbury the armada isn't here yet i mean yes she can do the figurehead bit but you don't want her on the battlefield she can't fight but also she might get captured and so again being female does have its advantages in some ways because what happens winter of 1140 1141 is that there is

34:58a siege at lincoln king stephen is besieging lincoln castle he's surprised by the army of robert of gloucester a battle ensues in february 1141 and he is captured now up till this point the fact that he's been anointed that impregnated with kingship has been the ace in his hand but once he's a prisoner suddenly the balance has shifted so matilda's quids in god is not with stephen anymore this is matilda's moment she is going to step forward and become queen and so she advances to westminster

35:34to prepare for her coronation the point at which her queenship will take effect and so that happens and what is what is the impact of that on her legitimacy it doesn't happen that's the big problem the big biggest pivotal moment in the whole story is that once she has reached westminster in 1141 suddenly and you'll be amazed to hear this both medieval chroniclers and modern historians say

36:05ah yes but a previously undetected character flaw starts letting her down it turns out in fact one of the chroniclers says puts it very well the guest of stefani says she at once put on an extremely arrogant demeanor instead of the modest gait and bearing proper to the gentle sex and began to walk and speak and do all things more stiffly and more haughtily than she had been wont so she's behaving like a king she is behaving like a king what else is she supposed to do she's supposed to take command

36:38her father was the lion of justice inflexible in his authority but the man who thinks he's putting her on the throne which is steven's younger brother henry bishop of winchester thinks he's going to be the power behind the throne he thinks matilda should be doing exactly what he tells her to she's not having any of that she is not having any of that so what happened so why did she not get anointed because at the point where she is waiting for her coronation henry bishop of winchester the one who's

37:09got her to that point he thinks and the londoners both decide we're not happy with this the londoners pour out of the city drive matilda away from westminster she has to flee again her moment passes and not only that but then at winchester another battle happens or another skirmish happens where robert of gloucester is taken prisoner at that point you've got to do a prisoner swap because she can't do without her brother to lead her troops robert for steven steven's back in play the whole thing starts

37:43couldn't she just find any old bishop and you know i mean any cathedral would do just get where abbey and just get anointed you'd think wouldn't you but the difficulty is any old bishop will that do really i mean it's better than nothing yeah i i if you and i had been there tom she might have had some better better advice but great shame part of the problem is even getting to a cathedral because the white cloak and the nighty in the snow is oxford yes in the winter of 1142 she's under siege in

38:14oxford and she manages to slip out through the snow across the frozen river seven miles in the snow wearing a white cloak for camouflage she is brave physically as well as in every other way but she just can't steven won't land the killer blow and she can't okay so 19 years of anarchy to cut to the chase how does this anarchy end and what does it mean for steven for matilda and for well no longer little baby henry plantagenet i mean he's kind of grown up by now what we're looking at is matilda's

38:50judgment here yes she was indomitable but no she wasn't inflexibly arrogant because by the late 1140s she sees there's no way through for her she is not going to be able to unite the anglo-norman barons around female leadership but she has handily provided someone who might represent the future and that is her son henry although he's young still he is proving himself to be a very

39:23formidable ruler by this point in normandy isn't he he is he is recognized his father has managed more or less to conquer normandy in the name of his wife and his son in 1150 at which point henry is what are we talking 16 17 he is recognized as duke of normandy he then comes to england and by this stage it's clear that even the people who still support steven as king are beginning to talk about henry as the lawful heir and so there is scope there for a deal the deal is steven will continue to rule

39:57but when steven dies henry matilda's son will inherit the grandson of henry the first will become henry the second and that is the deal that's done in 1153 at the treaty of winchester so henry the second we will be coming to in our next episode because of course he has a very famous and feisty wife in the form of eleanor of aquitaine and we'll be talking about her but before we before we end steven dies henry succeeds him to become henry the second of england um what happens to matilda matilda

40:35stays in normandy in a sense she's in retirement in a sense she's taken up a very much approved role now of um spending a lot of her time at an abbey of which she's a particular patron but she is the elder stateswoman of her son's regime he looks to her for advice she's a kind of matriarchal figure she's a matriarchal figure he doesn't always take her advice when she warns against making thomas beckitt archbishop of canterbury he doesn't listen to her should listen to mommy but she is this fount

41:09of wisdom but in such a way in such an acceptably female way that if you go to rouen cathedral where her remains ended up in the end there is an epitaph to her carved into the wall and what this epitaph says is great by birth greater by marriage greatest in her offspring here lies the daughter wife and mother of henry okay so she is defined by her male relations and just before we end can i ask

41:44does she serve as a kind of object lesson to future generations is her attempt to make herself a kind of regnant queen um recollected uh or is that not influential on how people come to think about the um possibility of a female monarch it certainly is remembered but it faces in two directions her example because in one sense it is clear that a woman can transmit the right to inherit the crown

42:15of england her son has become king she's the daughter of a king and she's the mother of a king so claims through women operate in england and all future kings are descended from her but her attempt to claim the throne for herself resulted in 19 years when christ and his saints slept so the example it gives of female rule is a deeply alarming and worrying one okay so thank you helen and

42:46we will be back next time as i said with eleanor of aquitaine the wife of henry ii matilda's son and she will be our second she wolf so i hope you enjoyed um this first episode of our new super soar away miniseries and if you would like to see the rest and you're not a member of the rest is history club you can go to the rest is history.com sign up there for this and a host of sensational

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43:49of the story subscribe now at bloomberg.com hi everybody we are back with another absolutely colossal update about the rest is history festival well it's massive so on the 4th and 5th of july we will be at hampton court palace we have a weekend of brilliant talks live music exclusive access to historic royal palaces collections and yes dominic most exciting of all this is the thing i have been pushing for and i'm so looking forward to it we have medieval combat a terrifying brutal yet completely thrilling sport it is going to be an

44:27unforgettable two days it is indeed and um at the core of the festival of these talks we've got some more talks to add to the lineup so i will be talking to the brilliant tudor historian tracy borman about the secrets of the six wives of henry viii i'll be talking to a friend of the show and irish national treasure paul rouse about whether there is an alternative universe in which irelands could have remained part of the united kingdom we'll be talking to katia hoyer about weimar germany

44:57and in particular the town of weimar through history and professor adam smith will be telling the story of america through three presidents and on top of all that i'll be doing a special event with ian hislop about the history of satire and i will be on stage with mary beard and we will be talking about just how strange just how alien just how different to us rome was or maybe it wasn't i will be talking to helen castor about elizabeth the first and we'll be discussing whether she truly

45:30was england's greatest ruler or maybe whether that title should still be claimed by athelstan i will be talking to ali ansari about all things persian with dan jackson about the pit of death and i will be talking to friend of the show willie dalrymple about the links between ancient india and greece and rome absolutely incredible scenes and of course on both days tom and i will be on stage doing a show together as well so on the first day we'll be answering all our club members questions and then

46:02to close the festival we will do a definitive ranking of the all-time top friends of the show so lots to look forward to and beyond that there is so much else that will be happening across the weekend so think of it as the ultimate summer history hangout and your tickets will give you full access to explore the great tudor palace of hampton court and indeed the royal tennis court so that'll be very exciting there'll be food and drink fit for a king which sounds very enticing i picture

46:34the very glamorous people that are our club members and their summer garb they're on the lawn at hampton court palace they're chatting about history and delightful surroundings sipping on a refreshing gin and tonic and it's probably the most civilized festival there's ever been i mean that's what i imagine anyway just a reminder the tickets are exclusive to club members and if you are not a member now is the perfect time to join so head over to the rest is history.com to sign up and grab your

47:09tickets and of course have access to a whole range of supplementary benefits once you have signed up to the rest is history.com all you do then is log into the members area and you select festival and it's all very obvious but you know what there is a twist if you do this you will be entered into a genuinely unbelievable prize draw and that prize draw if you win you and three other people it's like the golden ticket in charlie and the chocolate factory because you will be given the chance to be upgraded to the

47:43premium experience and the premium experience will give you among other things unlimited food and drink for free all day do not miss it can't wait to see you there