PEL Presents PvI#122: Hello from Iran w/ AmirAli Maleki

0:00This is Philosophy vs. Improv, where two sages try to teach each other a thing or two, and maybe you, the audience, get something out of it as well. This is Mark Lintzenmayer, emceeing from the philosophy side, and my co-host is... Mary Hines, joining you from Los Feliz, Los Angeles, representing improvisation. And we are joined by our guest... It's me, Amir Ali Maliki. I'm a philosophy researcher based in Iran.

0:31Thank you for having me. This is my honor. Are we your first American podcast? Yes, of course. Happy birthday! Congratulations! Yeah. Yeah, thank you. Yeah. I never talked to the podcast in the United States or any places abroad, but my first experience of podcast with one of my best friends who told me, hey, come on, let's talk together about some stuff. And it was his first episode in Iran. And this is exactly my second experience in whole podcast world.

1:04Iran, America, everywhere. I love it. But you're first international, so apparently you have a penchant for firsts. How fantastic. I just want to try my best with your audience. I hope we can do something very well together. That's a great intention. I always start every single improv class I teach. Always the first thing of day one is intention setting. And why are you here? And what you want to get out of it? Because I feel like that's very important to feel it, think it, verbalize it.

1:36And then on the last class, we come back and we reflect. And I don't say strengths and weaknesses. I say strengths and strongers. So looking back on day one, how do you feel like you've become stronger? And where do you want to continue to be? So reflections and intentions for the win. It's a very great question for me. I'm always trying to talk in international conferences to just talk about the philosophy and the way of thinking in my own country.

2:08And really, I love to show to the people around the world how we can even think about different subjects. And especially, we are staying in a really, really difficult situation. And because of that, I think it's very necessary for us. And as a person who was born in 2002, I really love this new media. For me, it's new. And I'm always wanting to talk with another person around the world. Philosophizing in this modern world is kind of like this.

2:41You know, we have to talk and discuss together. Maybe if we were back and we put some camera or a microphone between Aristotle and Plato's, maybe they do something, you know, similar to each other. And I think it's a gift for our days to make connection, talk to each other and try to reach out and see what's going on in the whole world. I think we need to hear more from the Iranian community. And this is the way we can talk to each other.

3:12Let me ask sort of the obvious question. I'm sure that is occurring to our listeners or viewers here is, wait, you're a philosopher in Iran. Isn't Iran a harsh totalitarian state that would, if you were saying anything that was the least bit heretical, they would stamp down on you? What is it to be a philosopher in Iran? It's very tough. You know, maybe they are here right now beyond my door. I don't know what is the meaning of philosopher. You know, philosophy is the person who can standing for freedom and rights and fight for

3:47it. I think this is the exact meaning for the philosopher who can stand up for his own pain and his people pain. I can't call myself Iranian philosopher, but I can call myself a philosophy researcher. But in Iran, it's very, very hard. If I want to talk about some of Islamic philosophers, just like al-Farabi, if you know him, he talked about something, an essential city. An essential city, the person fights for their first need, for their first desire.

4:23And this city is not a different philosophy because philosophers have to be there for fighting and talking with the people. And, you know, as a member, they have to talk about what is really important. And I think philosopher in Iran, it means fighter. You have to be a fighter. You have to go through all the problems and talk. And yes, especially so hard, you know, and I'm always trying to do it as best as I can. And even I'm young and my parents are, you know, they're worried about everything I'm

4:59always talking about. Parents are always going to be worried about everything, all of the time. So give them something nutrient-rich to worry about. They can understand, you know, because they say, come on, this is a young person in Iran. He wants to talk about his right. And why not? I need to talk about my life. I need to talk about my right. I think it's very hard, but I accept it because I know this is the only way I can philosophize.

5:29I think we need to be a kind of a stroller. Go to people's lives, understand them, try to be one of them. And there is a philosopher in Islamic philosophy who called it Ibn Tafil. It's a beautiful name. We don't need to ruin it by translating it into English. English is not superior. It's just another language. Yeah, there's Ibn Sina and Avya Sena, you know, something like this, you know, and I don't know, maybe there is any translate.

6:00But Ibn Tafil talk about very special way. I call it virtual philosopher. And this means that the philosopher is the person who have to be in the middle of the subject, have to do it as the way he thinks is true. Maybe it's poetry. Maybe he's making a movie. I just, you know, analyze it for nowadays, Mike. Maybe it's a podcast. And you have to be in the middle of the people because you are belong to them.

6:31I'm so sorry. Hey, is anyone in there? It's the thought police. We noticed there's some smoke coming out of your window. Actually, Amir and Amir here is here on training. We're just burning Western books. It's OK to burn books, right? Oh, you're burning books. Yes. Oh, it's totally fine to burn books. But I feel like you might be covering up some deeper thoughts because we don't get dispatched on thought police calls like this unless there's some really intense thinking going on.

7:03I mean, I guess mostly it's just because I'm burning just the footnotes of the books. I like when the stories are self-contained. If you have to refer to a bunch of other literature, I feel like that dilutes the thought. The thought should be able to reach directly into the hearts. OK, get out of the way. We're coming in. We're coming in. Amir, this is the second part of your training. We're going to need to. If you could actually pull that sheet up from under the bed, that's normally a good place where thoughts and ideas hide. Amir, lift up that cover and I'll crawl under the bed for a second. Hold on. Oh, my God.

7:36There are five leather bound journals under here. Not only are you thinking, but you're journaling. This is a stage 59C offense. Yeah.

7:50What I have to say, journaling. Do you want to read some of them? Is that what's what's going on here? Is that I don't mind sharing my my dreams. I have to read something for you. Feel free to read one of the dream journals. Yeah. Read one. Amir, that would be great for your thought police training. Why don't you go ahead and open up one of those journals? And we found that the place where thoughts and feelings hide the most is on page 22. So go ahead and open up page 22. And if you're having trouble reading the handwriting, I know you're a trainee. I'm happy to take over. Go ahead.

8:21What poetry, what blasphemy lies on page 22? Okay. Page 22. Yep. I'm still here and I have towels and I think no guns, no bullets and no frightening scenes can stop me. I'm here because I want to and I accept it. Hands on your back. We're taking you in. That's just the dream. I mean, I can't control when I'm in my waking thoughts. When I'm away from the journal, I think only very pious, anti-freedom, book burning kind

8:55of thing. Dream police here. It's been escalated from thoughts to dreams. There's way too much free thinking going on in this small of an apartment. Are you aware of the song by Cheap Trick? Oh, sorry. That's Western. Oh, I'm revealing knowledge of Western music. Like, I'm sorry that... No, I listened to some Western music, but not dream police, but I can't realize what's happening here. You know, the dream police. Yeah. And scene. We can call it there. We'll tap you at it. I wanted to throw you into an improv scene, throw you in the deep end and see.

9:28You did a great job. Very brave. That actually seems the meanest thing and probably breaks some rule where you put somebody else in the scene on the spot by saying, oh yeah, tell us what those initials stand for. Tell us what it says on this piece of paper. Sing the song that you were singing to me yesterday. Why does that translate as mean to you? Well, at least as a first-time improviser. But Amir, how did you feel about that being put on the spot? You know, I love to play. You know, I love it. You know, because if you talk in my language, I will eat you when you try to play something.

10:05But it was so hard, but I love it. You know, I just... What's going on here? You know, I just listen to all the podcasts. But when you are here and you stay here, it's something different. But I love it. You know, playing, it's one of the most important things in my life. And I'm always looking at it. You know, the theater, the playing. I love it because it's so live. And I can think immediately. And this is how I can manage my mind. You know, I'm always, you know, just not the playing in the theater, but playing in the

10:38playground with the children. I'm always a stander and look at them. And try to realize what's going on there because I can think, I can get something out from it. Something for philosophizing, something for talking. And, you know, maybe it's funny for you, but I'm always looking at my brother who tried to play with everything. And I always look at him and I just think to myself, what's going on here exactly? And can I involve? Can I play with you?

11:08Can I do something for you? And, you know, I'm always seeing myself kind of in playing as, you know, I don't know you know or not, but Gautamer, in a very fantastic way, he talked about play. He said, play, just ask us to come into it and be a part of it. And I think what he did to me, it was very harsh, but it was very perfect. And because I can't think immediately about what happened. So that's a good name drop. So yeah, Gautamer, Mary is a 20th century German, hermeneutics is his thing, right?

11:43How do you interpret texts? How do you interpret, you know, this was sort of his big contribution, kind of following on Heidegger we might've talked about a little before. But anyway, that's one of the names I noticed in the articles, I will share the articles you shared with me, with our audience. So folks can look at the blog post associated with this at philosophyimprov.com or partiallyexaminedlife.com. And you can see Amir has been very good about writing the kind of philosophy that seems well suited for the internet age, right? It's very clear. It's in very clear English.

12:13I assume you've been learning English since five years old. How long have you been speaking English? Professionally, I started to learn English when I was 11 or 12. And then right now I'm 23 years old. Yeah. When you read Gautamer or something, are you reading it in English or are there Arabic translations or what? In Iran, we don't speak Arabic. We speak Persian. Okay. That was, I was starting to Google it and I knew I'd be wrong. All right. Sorry.

12:40And if you have any Iranian audience, they're going to kill you after this. Yes, I've never, never talk about it again. Yeah. And we can look at the point of view that we are always learning and that the philosophy around, around this podcast is to be fallible and to be wrong and to listen and to play and to learn. So another option is grace for when people are learning something new and doing their best. Let me reinterpret my mistake because Al-Farabi originally written in Arabic, right?

13:15Not in Persian or what was some of these original texts? Wrote in Arabic, yes. But because the Arabic language was the kingdom language there, but the philosophy tradition in Iran back to ancient Persia, they kind of mix up so many things together, especially for example, you know, we have some tradition, it's called political writings, or as we call it in Persian, Siyasatnam and Nevisi.

13:45That's beautiful. It came from Eng. Yeah. I love languages. That sounds so beautiful. I love that. So Persian, Farsi, were you also learning Arabic as a philosophy student of Islamic philosophy or what's the range of languages that you need to learn? Yes, yes, yes, yes. But not very, very, you know, perfect, but I'm trying to read Arabic because, you know, the Guhran language is Arabic and kind of we forced to learn this language when we was

14:15in the medulla school. And back then we always tried to read it elementary school for Guhran. And especially I study humanities in high school in Iran and humanities, Arabic language, it's so hard and kind of harsh and I hate it. As I told you, I can't even translate. If you remember that, I talked to you about some, for Robbie's essay, I can't even translate it and I can compare it with Persian translate and the original in Arabic.

14:47But, you know, I'm not an expert, but right now in this age, I really love learning languages. You know, it makes me to think wider. You know, when I was a child, my father always told me, if you learn one language, another language, you become two percent. Hey there, let's stop for the first of our two ad breaks. Remind you that where you subscribe via the Patreon, which you can do at patreon.com slash philosophy improv. Then you could still be listening to the podcast through the very same podcast player you're

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16:55After your purchase, they'll ask you where you heard about them. Please support our show and tell them we sent you. Obviously, in the U.S., we're pretty stunted as far as languages go. I mean, my kids actually were in a Spanish immersion program, so they actually really know how to speak Spanish, but our Spanish was, you know, I took some classes in middle school and high school, and I remember almost none of it because I don't have to use it. I took German and a little bit of French in college and grad school, but basically, I can pronounce the words. If I read philosophy that brings in a word from German, I know how to pronounce it, and I know

17:28some basic roots, it's not in any way competent. I couldn't speak these languages with anybody at all. Mary, what was your language immersion? I had a different experience, and I think it's different based on age that we went through school and training programs, et cetera. I speak German pretty well. I get anxious about it because the dative and the genitive and the conjugation, and it's not something I currently use frequently enough, but my family is Austrian, so I wanted to learn German because we have a pretty strong connection with them.

18:01So I first learned German when I was visiting my family in Austria for a month. I think I was like 12 or 13. I hadn't started taking German classes yet, but I had a bit of an immersion myself being in Austria, and they were true to the generalization of German and Austrian personalities, which I have learned to love and celebrate. They were like, if you want to... They would say this in German, like, if you want to eat, you ask in German.

18:31So they forced me to learn German. So I dove into it because I wanted to eat, and I also wanted to get along with my family. And then after that, I really dedicated myself to German in high school, and then I was an exchange student in Germany in Waisel, and I still have a very strong relationship with my cousins over there. One of them is an opera singer, and the other one is a scientist, and we're like a year apart, so with my cousins over there. So my experience was different, but I think mine was driven by a desire to eat and to connect

19:06with my family. That was an important part of my heritage. You know, the first time I realized I have to learn foreign language, it was the time I went to Paris when I was 30, 40 years old. And I went to Paris, and I wasn't so good in English. And I just look at these people and say, come on, I want to talk with them. I want to make some communication. And from this perspective, my father told me, yeah, if you learn another language, you become another person too, and you have two identities, one of them in English, one of

19:41them in Persian, one of them in French. And I just like advice and say, yes, I love, I really love to make connection with people all around the world. And I'm always trying to learn some new languages because I'm addicted to it, kind of, you know? And if you leave me free, I can learn, you know, maybe five or six languages in my whole life. This is my goal. Maybe German, you know, I talk French a little bit, Arabic, and maybe Japanese. I really love it. I just want to add something into there.

20:12I feel like one of the roots of the problems with international relations that we have mostly centered around the concept of the ugly American is that people are not curious enough. They are not selfless enough. They are not open-hearted, open-minded enough to put themselves through the experience of being uncomfortable, being new, being bad, being wrong. I wish people were more curious and worldly.

20:44Maybe it's a different situation if you are just traveling, right, notoriously in France. If you try to use your terrible French that you learned in school, the French people will not appreciate that and they will talk to you in English and because either you're doing good French, perfect French, or just don't even bother. But I think in a social situation like that is very different from in a scholarly situation where we want to get to the meat of things. I want to be able to talk at a high level of abstraction. So if I'm trying to do that in German, it's going to be a mess.

21:16So I will use the German only when I'm reading German authors and they have a technical term that can't really be translated well to English. So those are the things that I will learn in German or in whatever the language is. And definitely American scholarship has improved so that we don't feel the need to anglicize every foreign name, right? Famously, like Confucius. That's not a Chinese word. It's Konfuzi or Lao Tzu as opposed to Lao Tzu. Like even just the spelling has changed.

21:47And you mentioned Avicenna, right? This is one of the chain of philosophy that went from ancient Greece and Rome. And then with the fall of the Roman Empire, a lot of texts got lost, but were preserved in the Arabic world. So we have Arabic philosophers that then, when the Middle Ages get going, they discover all this Arabic philosophy and discover the ancient Greeks through the Arabs in some way. So some of the names that they brought over were Avaroes, as they anglicized it, and Avicenna, which now scholars, oh, it's Ibn Sina and Ibn Rushud.

22:21Yeah, Ibn Rushd. Okay, I'm not pronouncing it right. We haven't done an episode on him yet, but... You know, just let me tell you something. I have to stop you because this is not Arabic philosophy. It's Iranian philosophy. Second of all, it's Islamic philosophy. Sure. And not Islamic as a religion, Islamic as a culture. If I want to be honest with you, all the details that happened in this area I live. You know, the first time a rep attacked my country for Brokden, the Sasanian Empire, they

22:56don't know how they can run a country. And they just asked the Persian person, because they have a huge background of leading the war, and they just called him. And some of the persons just like, Hormozan, just come and teach them to how they can lead a country. And because of that, when we say it's Arabic philosophy, it's wrong. It's Iranian philosophy with the base of Zartos historical background and mix it with Islamic

23:30and become a culture. And Arab person also loves it too. But this is not Arabic philosophy. It's Iranian philosophy if we want to be honest with audience. Aha, here we are. We have invaded Kershastan. Oh, look at the luscious lands. Peter, Peter, did you bring the flag so that we can claim Kershastan in the name of Habinstans? I brought the flag.

24:01We will claim this whole land for... Oh, yes, wonderful. Put the flag into the ground so it is now our country.

24:09Do you think the locals will object to this, or is this even a question? There is a local that is cresting over the hill. Hello.

24:19Greetings. Buenos Aires. Hello. Hi. Oh, it is... Hello. So this is now our country. We have decided that you can stay here if you want. You want to stay here with us in the new country? But you might have to change to our religion, if that's okay. You're going to have to change everything. You're going to have to drop who you are, pick up someone new, shed something of that, change every way that you think.

24:49Oh, my God. Oh, my God. I forgot the manual of how to run a country. Do you have any local resources to running the countries? Yes, of course, but I have to tell you, this is not your country. Oh, that is cute. It is making a joke at us. It is making funny. Maybe they have a different notion of ownership.

25:20We have the notion of the legal ownership, which we have, but it is a sacred trust. What is the Persian word for having a sacred trust? It's different than legal ownership. I don't have the manual, so I don't know. I think that this is your biggest success even can walk into this country. Well, you had the gate was open. So we saw that the gate was open. No, the gate wasn't open. We fight for it. But no, no, no. The gate wasn't open.

25:50We fight for it. But unfortunately, our leaders become not a really great person. Well, that's great because now we are your leaders. Let's have a lemonade party. All right. But you can keep this country as an amana. That's the word I was looking for. Amana, it means you have the sacred trust. We will trust you to run the country, but in our name. Did you read it from one of my articles? I was hoping you would volunteer it yourself, but I would not have to pull it up again.

26:23You know, yes, you can keep it as amana as we are, Iranian person, are very hospitable person. Okay, and don't worry about it. But I will tell you what's going to happen. You don't have any culture. And welcome. We train you for becoming a cultural person. They're going to kill me after this. Well, let's end the scene before we kill you. One of the articles that I will send people to, you're talking specifically about the Strait of Hormuz, right?

26:54We haven't actually talked directly about the fact that you're doing this during a war. You're writing about the Strait of Hormuz and the sentiments among the populace in Iran of like, yeah, we should be able to charge tolls on it. And of course, there's this international norm that says, no, the seas are open. But the seas are not just open, right? You have to actually – maintenance is required. So some sort of support, maybe not like I just want to put up a toll booth and charge whatever I can get from the market. But hey, other international community, you could help us defray the costs of this thing that we do not legally own.

27:30But we have taken it upon – it's like adopt a highway as they have in the US where some organization like, okay, this stretch of – this one mile of Highway 32 will go out every weekend and will clean up the garbage from it. And the fact that Iran and some other countries do that sort of maintenance, this is a great example of the kind of thing. I don't speak Persian, but like, oh, here's a word, a Persian word that names some distinction that philosophers have not otherwise made. So, all right, this is exactly why we're doing philosophy that delves into other languages.

28:02Yeah, first of all, I have to say that I wrote this essay after the war. First of all, I'm telling some stories and then I'm leading to some philosophical or philosophical and legal subject. And we just sit in my uncle's house around together and my dad asked me, is there any chance that we can charge United States or in other countries in the world from here in the Strait of Hormos, just like Panama and another blah, blah, blah.

28:34Panama, it's a whole different world and Strait of Hormos is a natural way and we're not allowed as in the law, in the international law, we are not allowed to ask money for just acres in here. But what we can do is understand the Strait of Hormos as existence, just like a human being, just like animals, just like trees. And it can kind of, in a politic way, it can breathe, it can see, it can feel, and we have to save it.

29:07And we can just meet some international organization between Iran, Oman and all the countries they want to use it to just charge a box for helping the environment. This is my whole idea on this article. But I think for this, we need clear government in Iran, and as we don't have one, it's going to be very hard, yeah. But I think the Strait of Hormos, it's the way for all the people around the world, and there is no need to charge.

29:38As a philosophy researcher, I think the Strait of Hormos, it's existence. And we don't need to pay something to Oman or Iran country for just a crossing there. And I believe it truly, this is a way of just being involved for some environmental activities if we want to just save it. And because of that, I write this article, and just it comes from my uncle's house. They're sitting, they're drinking tea.

30:09They all of them believe we have to charge it from another country. And they just look at me and, what do you think? Do you believe that another country have to pay? And I say, no. How? And I say, just let me back to my room. Think. Write. And I'll come back to you. But never happened. Yeah. So if anybody says philosophy is not useful, well, right there. Okay, and you're pulling things from the Koran, from Al-Farabi to justify this principle.

30:41So, clearly useful. I think the philosopher, it's the person who tries to involve with the people because he is a part of people. And he needs to play some virtual character, as you do in this podcast. And sometimes they have to be a taxi driver and understand how he thinks when I talk to him. And then I try to realize that, how can I help to him?

31:12Because I have this goal to my life to just talk about it. Sometimes I need to be in a elementary school student. Sometimes I have to be a teacher. Sometimes I have to be a parent. And another philosopher, just as you mentioned, just like Al-Farabi, even I wrote something, it published yesterday in Juris.org about Parasu Ahmadi. She's an Iranian singer, and the government arrests her for just singing. I write about her because I just put myself in Parasu Ahmadi's situation.

31:50And I say, okay, if I were Parasu Ahmadi as a philosopher and as a singer, what I have to say? Because this is my duty, and I have to this. And because of that, I really believe this. We need to learn from past. You know, I think Mark Kiovali said that in one of his letters to one of his friends. And he said, I go walk, I talk with people, I sit in a bar, and maybe sometimes arguing. And after that, I back home with the whole of it and just dress up and sit behind my desk and open the books of ancient philosophers and thinkers and try to make a dialogue with them.

32:34I feel like it's very important for people to practice the ability of surrendering. When I'm teaching character, I teach it in a way, I think of it as either like a space suit that you step into or some kind of really big fur coat. And you put it on, you step into it, you suspend your disbelief, and you think, if this is true, then what else is true? You explore someone else's point of view, someone else's wants, needs, thoughts, feelings, and fears, and you allow yourself to go into it, which requires vulnerability, intimacy, courage, and compassion, which are traits that a lot of people drown out of themselves.

33:18But then the next piece is, after that is done, and you insert yourself into curiosity and play, like exploring this character, this different facet of a diamond that you flipped around, then you take it off. And then you come back to yourself, and then you take with you what works, and you leave what doesn't. Another thing that we say in improvisation is, your ego is not allowed in the room. Congratulations, you've got a big fat sense of self.

33:51Good job, you can have a cookie later. You get to leave that in the green room, and then you get to step into now, open-hearted, open-minded, knowing that everything that you say and everything that you hear is a gift, and you get to treat it thusly. So you don't have to agree, but you must accept. Yeah, I believe it too, yeah. And I believe the philosophy researcher or any humanities researcher are explorers, as you said, and we have to go out and talk with people and try to understand them.

34:27You know, when I said people, I mean myself too, you know? I'm just playing all the character in my mind, and I just think how they can philosophize it. I love that. Yes, you're already an improviser. People are improvisers, they just don't know it by the formal name. There is a joke I always talk about with my friends, and, you know, they say something in Persian, and after that, I make it in philosophical idea, just in a joke. And I say, hey, I'm a fucking improviser, and I can improvise everything right now, but not in English very well, but in Persian, yeah.

35:04But, yeah, I love this podcast idea because I truly believe in this kind of things. You know, you have to play, and you have to involve in the playground with the people and talk with them and make dialogue with them. And the philosophy is not just the person to sit down, be on his desk, and just read a book. Before that, as I mentioned, Mark, you have to go out and talk with the people and maybe have some argue with them. Not just in a philosophical language, no, as your own language.

35:37Just talk with them. Just try to understand how they want to reach you out. And not just as a philosopher, as a simple person. I'm not a philosopher researcher all the time. You know, after this podcast, we have some guests coming to our home, and I'm going to be a person who's going to serve them. I'm not a philosopher when I do this. But I think all the times about what here can help me to be my people and my nation voice all around the world as just a simple young person.

36:15I love that. That's so powerful and beautiful. And that leads to another adjacent concept in improvisation where, so we're sitting on the back line and the scene is going on. And as a player, we get to think, what does the scene need? What would serve this moment? So an analogy that I love, I referenced it previously, but I'm going to dive into it a little bit more. You are a diamond. The diamond is always present. Philosopher you and sun you and nice guy who always smiles at the lady at the flower market on the corner.

36:52You cannot get away. Those are all with you all of the time. So we get to choose which facet of the diamond are we letting light shine through, knowing that you can access any different parts of yourself as necessary and still be authentic to your true self and think, what does this moment need? How can I give a gift to this present moment with who I am and which aspect of me gets to come out to play? Of course. And as Mark mentioned, when we were in war and it was a really hard time, I always try to hear more and be involved more with people.

37:34And the first thing, can I talk about the memory about the first day of war? Yeah, please. So this is what was the crux of your pitch to us was being a philosopher and a person during wartime. And I'm very interested in the role of play that, as you keep mentioning, of course, we know philosophy is a great thing to have stoicism and whatnot when things are hard, when you're under oppression, right? The stoicism itself was developed by a slave to deal with constant oppression and stuff.

38:08So, you know, it's not like, oh, these are serious times. We can't engage in self-care and play and things like that. In fact, that's when you need them the most. But yeah, tell us more about your sort of strategy as a thinker during wartime here. The first day of war, it was so strange for me when I think about it. I was in the classroom and I was taught some logical problems to the students. We have a small class of logic and they are students of humanities in high school.

38:40And I just try to tell them how this logic works. And I don't know it either. Really great. But I try to do my best with them. And I just hear something clapping. I wrote it, I think, in one of my articles. And I just hear some people just clapping. I say, OK, it's a birthday, you know, it's a birthday party in a school. OK, very good. But I continue teaching. But they try to clap again. And I say, come on.

39:10I try to learn logic and I can't even understand it clearly when it's silent. I have to focus. And I open the door. I say, what's happened? And I say, Professor, they attack. Wow. What? Say, yes, they attack. Here is the American Air Force and Israel Air Force coming attack. And all the students were so happy because they think Trump is going to save them. And I just really worried about my family because their jobs in very, very strange places.

39:44And I just really worried about my father. And I just tried to call him, but I can't reach him out. And just one of my colleagues told to me, because there is two schools, told to me, we need help in another school. Do you want to join me and come? And after this big party, I just walked and sat down on the car and we just went to another school. And I just see they are younger than the first school. Some of them, they're just crying and they just want to call their mom. But the phone just cut off. And I just want to do something as a teacher.

40:16And I just try to make everything good for our children because I love them. And after that, I just try to walk from school to my home because it's really close. Sorry, can I just ask, what city are you in? I don't think we established that. I'm born in Tehran, but I live near a city to Tehran. It's called Karaj. Okay, so this is right where they were bombing. All right. If you search Karaj, you can see lots of attacks in Karaj. And especially, I think, four or five avenues next to us. I can show you even something here.

40:47I want to show you how I make my window safe. You know, can you see us? It's all like blacked up. Yeah. What I'm hearing you throughout all of this is how much heart and compassion you have for your community. And I'm so sorry that you are having to endure all of this. It's ghastly. And my question is, what do you want to leave people with around?

41:19How do you stay joyful, playful, curious, and kind in intense and inconscionable crisis? For me, philosophy saved me from all of this crisis because I just tried to figure out, as a man, how can I help my nation in a philosophical way? And how can I help them to think better and more clearly? And how can I call another country to just show them what's going on here in the middle

41:51of the streets, not in the middle of the news? And this is my goal when I wrote all of those articles I sent to Mike. And I always think to myself, philosophy is here for me to show me I need people. We have a philosopher in Iran we call Moskava Yerazi. He's a medieval, Islamic medieval philosopher. He said, if you don't want to live with the people, if you don't want to understand them, if you don't want to talk with them, if you don't want to evolve with them,

42:23it's better for you to go to the cave and live alone. And I truly believe that we need to be with our people. And this is the one way to keep me alive. You know, to talking with my partner, Nazanin, to talking with my friend, to talking with my parents, and to talking with my students. You know, we have online classes during the war, and I try to talk to them philosophy, logic, and history.

42:54In the whole online classes, I always try to talk with them in the first step. Because as a human being, I think we need each other. And as a philosopher, we have to cure each other and help each other in this whole crisis around the war. And I think this is the way the philosophy calling me and said to me, you have to stand up. I know it's hard. And I think it's kind of dangerous right now if I'm talking, you know,

43:24I don't know if it's dangerous or not. But I accept it because I have to talk about everything as a philosopher to help work, to understand me, or just one person. You know, Muhammad, the prophet of Islam, say, if you just can help one person, it means that you help all the person around the world. And maybe if I can help one person, to just reach at what's happened. The Iranian nations are different from the news.

43:57To reach them out, especially my American friends, they are not my enemy. I just try to make a dialect between nations. As an Iranian researcher, you as the American community, sometimes I write, sometimes I talk with my friends just like you. And this is, you know, the goal of my life. And I have this duty to just save all of my experience for the next generation. And this is why I think philosophy is, philosophy is making dialogues,

44:29philosophy is playing a game, philosophy is improvising the language of the people all around the world. And more important, philosophy is the way to remember, or as ancient Greeks say, animensis. To remember, it's the most option. We have to remember what happened around us. We have to remember how we can help each other. And we have to remember nothing's left, but just humanity. You are doing such brave, beautiful, poignant, powerful work. You are a lighthouse.

45:00You are a joy warrior. You have a beautiful exuberance and animus in you, like charisma. So thank you so much for everything you're doing. And thank you for this very flip ping-ponging into poignant, silly, poignant, silly conversation. And I've learned some things that I'll carry with me. And the ripple across the pond, I will go. Right now, I'm about to go into West Hollywood and walk a dog. And I'm riding the bus. And I'm going to do my best to carry compassion and curiosity with me down Hollywood Boulevard.

45:34Yeah, go to the Hollywood Boulevard and look into the people. Yeah, and look into the people and make dialogue with them, okay? Make dialogue with them. All right, I think we've accomplished what you have asked, which is to start the dialogue. Let's say goodbye for now. Have a great rest of your day. Bye-bye. Bye-bye, everybody. Bye. Thanks, Mark. Thanks, Amir. Thank you, listeners.

45:56Thanks for listening to Philosophy vs. Improv. Check out our homepage, philosophyimprov.com. To support the effort and get an ad-free experience with our post-game discussions, support us at patreon.com slash philosophyimprov. This podcast is a member of the Partially Examined Life family of podcasts. See partiallyexaminedlife.com. Baby, I should sell my soul. Bankrupt!

46:21Bankrupt! Bankrupt! Bankrupt!