Motor City Grind, Jim Chatas Interview

Sponsor Introduction

0:00You have a classic Ford that turns heads everywhere it goes? Don't let it just sit there. Let it steal the spotlight. We're looking for Mustangs, F-Series, and vintage Fords ready for their close-up in photo shoots, commercials, and even weddings. Put your classic to work at ClassicFordRentals.com. Just provide the info at the bottom of the page and let your Ford be the star. That's ClassicFordRentals.com. Looking to restore your classic ride? Trust National Parts Depot, the largest restoration parts supplier in the industry.

0:33From Mustangs and Camaros to Broncos and classic Ford trucks, NPD delivers the highest quality parts to fit your goals and your budget. With premium catalogs, best-sourced products, and family-owned dedication, NPD helps bring American history back to life. I keep all four of my classics on the road with NPD. You should, too. Visit NPDLink.com today, where a restoration begins.

Episode Preview

1:00Coming up today on this episode of Ford Mustang, The Early Years Podcast. I think that's one of our greatest challenges when we are integrating so many different products and manufacturers, and you want this fuel pump to work with that fuel system. A lot of times, it goes fine, but there are times when you're going through that, and you're trying to get something to work, and it's not working. They're not talking together, so you try to get on the phone, get some customer support on the product that you're working on.

1:31Those are the moments you're like, oh my gosh, this is crazy. No matter what, we always solve the problem. You have to solve the problem. You have to. And sometimes it takes, you know, like a lot of late nights and bringing in some specialty guys to help solve some stuff, and we do it.

Introduction to Motor City Grind

1:49Whatever it takes, you got to get it working. Welcome to the Ford Mustang First Generation The Early Years Podcast. Every week, we will have conversations with collectors, experts, weekend warriors, and those in the know when it comes to first-generation ponies. Start your engines, and let's go. All right, we're back in the podcast. My name is Doug Sandler, of course, from, I was going to say, from the Nice Guys on Business Podcast, but I forget.

2:22I'm not hosting that show today, although, Jim, this would be a great conversation for us to have a business conversation, the business of these big builds that's happening.

Defining a Super Build

2:31Welcoming back, Jim Chattis from Motor City Grind. We'll make sure we put links in the show notes for all of the information that he's going to share with us today. Jim, I think you've been here three or four times, so welcome back. You're a preferred guest on the Ford Mustang The Early Years Podcast. Welcome back to the show. Well, thank you, Doug. It's nice to be back, and it's nice to be preferred. Yeah, man. Yeah, man. Well, speaking of preferred, let's talk about that. You are a preferred builder of many of these. I think you said it was called a – I've never heard the term, so I'm sure I'm a little behind – super build.

3:04I think it's pretty cool that you've been involved in all of these, a little different than just, hey, I have some rust on my Mustang. Can you get rid of the cancer and put some metal there? So what is – define a super build for me so everybody in our audience knows what it is for your world. That's a homemade – I came up with that, so I don't know. I'm sure that people will classify super build in many different ways, but it seems like of late – you know, what I would maybe classify as a super build is a car that has beyond a resto mod.

3:37You know, when we – you and I first started talking, it was a lot about building cars and restoring them, and we still do those types of cars as well. But it seems of late, everybody wants a lot of horsepower. They want a lot of amenities, and you'd think you'd run out after, like, oh, we'll put AC on it, but, you know, it goes deep into the build. You know, we're doing electric brakes. We're doing electric steering. We're big fans of the Dakota Digital Gauges, and, you know, the fuel systems on these supercharged Coyotes are significant.

Complexity of Modern Builds

4:10So all that just – it keeps building onto itself, right? Well, and just to put a fine point on this piece of cutlery here, you know, when you're talking about something like Dakota Digital, I've looked up just the parts alone for Dakota Digital can be in the thousands of dollars range. And a lot of people didn't even pay that for the shell of the Mustang that they got. So just to put in the digital dash, and then you said, hey, I want to – I think it would be good to talk about things like Coyote swaps and Shelby clones and Eleanor's and all of that kind of change that people can make.

4:48Like, typically, when somebody's doing that, they're putting over $100,000 into their vehicle, aren't they? Yeah, I think even, you know, again, when we talk, the prices have gone up so much just on parts. And when you get to these super builds, the complexity, and it's not just buying a supercharged motor that costs $30,000. It's all the wiring that goes with it. It's the beefed-up transmission, the drivetrain. It just kind of, like, adds up. But, yeah, it's just – it's been pretty remarkable the last several years after COVID, things accelerated a little bit.

5:23And then even in the last couple of years, they've gone to another level as well. But I'm going to push back just for a quick second. It's a testament to the quality of the work that you are doing, not necessarily the quality of the market coming to you. The work that you're putting out there is proving itself over and over again when you were doing the, you know, putting the vintage air systems in. And people were getting back and like, hey, this is great. You know, you did a great job. I got a buddy of mine that wants to do a coyote swap.

5:54Could you do that? Then the coyote swap goes to, hey, can you do a complete build for me? And now, all of a sudden, you're the guy that's the go-to guy. It's a reputation well-earned. So I got to, you know, got to give yourself some credit and pats on the back for that. Yeah, I think that in the team, you know, I work real hard to maintain a culture here and just having good team members. And that has everything to do with, you know, we've built several cars. These guys have built several cars together. So they know the level of quality that we expect, the standard that we've established.

6:27And so this internally, that's really important. So externally, it's equally as important. So when people do come to us, they want to have, you know, a type of quality that matches a value in the price that they're going to pay.

Marketing and Client Relationships

6:40So I'm going to ask this loaded question here, and I don't know the answer to it. Maybe we'll work it out together on the tail end of this. But it's like, okay, and how many dollars have you put into marketing? I got to be honest, Doug, I'm very low on marketing. Like nothing, right? I have zero marketing budget. Right, right, right. Right. No, no, that's my point exactly. It's the company that is standing on its own two feet. You're not pushing people through your pipeline. You're having people reach out to you and saying, hey, this is what I want done because of the quality of the work that you've done on the tail end.

7:12And I'm glad you answered that. Hey, I got to be honest. I put no money into marketing. I have no marketing budget. But hell yeah, man, hats off to you again. That's the kind of business that you want to run. You don't want to force traffic through your pipeline. You want to make sure that the business is coming to you because of the great work you're doing. Is that fair? Yep, and we're very blessed to be in that position where we don't go look and they come to find us. And it's amazing how the stuff that I do on Instagram, little posts here and there.

7:43If I post a car that we just painted, once in a while they are for sale. And then we strike up a conversation and that's how we get more work, more on the national level. So it's pretty cool. We've got a pretty good mix of cars across the country and the local guys that still come to us for that. I think about it and since we first had that conversation when my only quality decision that I would have to make is what color is the bucket going to be that I'm going to wash my car with to actually get some wrench turning myself, which has been kind of fun.

8:14And then buying a couple of old trucks and fixing them up. And I think about this one that I have right now we call Herminti Fresh. It's a lunar green 1967 F-250 and basically had a really worn, tired I-300 inline six in there. And it had a worn transmission. And so I took the shell of the truck and the frame of the truck and I basically gutted everything else. The engine transmission came out and I'm rebuilding both of them. And just to see those, the excitement level of having a, it's not even a brand new engine, it's just a rebuilt 300 and a rebuilt C4 transmission.

8:50And so what I love about it is that, that, you know, it's like you have a brand new car on the, on the tail or truck in this case, on the, on the tail end of that. What's the reaction that you're getting from a lot of people as they're, as they're picking up their cars or getting them shipped back to them and they're turning the key for the first time in them? Well, I think, uh, you know, it's amazing that the amount of money people invest in a car and they've never driven it and they don't know what to expect when they get it. But, you know, so that sometimes it makes a little word, you try to educate and make people aware of what's going on.

9:21They are modern cars, they're new, but they're still old cars, right? So there's things you got to kind of get used to and accept. And, um, so the, the big thing, I think we just launched as Eleanor to a client, he's a local client, great guys and super to work with. And, uh, just to see his excitement when he comes in and the first time you start the motor and you look at their faces light up, it's, it's just amazing, you know, and, you know, I never, I never tire of it. Cause every time you start a car for the first time, it's a big accomplishment, right?

9:51There's a lot of things that go together to make that first hit. And so I, uh, I really, I really love to see their faces and, and, um, their reactions to it and then getting into them.

Challenges and Solutions in Restoration

10:03And, um, when you go for a test drive, when they're, when they're local and, you know, it's just cool because I really like when people have old cars and they, they're used to like the, the wavy steering and the brakes. You're like, I'm not sure it's going to stop. And then you do the new stuff and there is a noticeable, uh, difference in, in terms of, uh, the braking, the, the steering, the, the shifting of the transmission, the fire of the motor, all that's really, it's really great. And to, for them to be surprised is, is just, it's pretty gratifying.

10:37I, uh, I think about also, you know, you mentioned something, all of the little things, the little systems that bring down a big car or a big truck, you know, even something as simple as if you're, if you're still running points. In your distributor, that little thing could stop the entire car or truck from running. And then you go down this rabbit hole of trying to, uh, you know, diagnose what the problem is. Yeah. And in these new cars, all of the things that have to work together in order for it all to work from something as simple as the ignition to electronic fuel injection to, you know, the, any possible thing could go wrong and just completely put that car on the sidelines as opposed to on the street.

11:18I think that's one of our greatest challenges when we are integrating so many different products and manufacturers and, um, you want, you know, this fuel pump to work with that fuel system. And a lot of times it goes fine, but there are times when you, you know, you're going through that and you're trying to get something to work and it's not working. They're not talking together. So you try to get on the phone with, you know, get some customer support on, on the product that you're working on. And so those are the moments you're like, Oh my gosh, this is crazy. And, you know, but you always, no matter what, we always solve the problem.

11:52You have to solve the problem. You have to. And sometimes it takes, you know, like a lot of late nights and, um, bringing in some specialty guys to help solve some stuff. And, and we do it, whatever it takes, you got to get it working. You know, when it, when it comes to, um, you know, the, the talent that's behind the team, you know, you think about the guys that are coming in and women that are coming in to do work on these vehicles. This is truly a passion for them because it's not just, you know, put a number 18 screw into a space and turn a bolt.

12:23It's, it's, there is a lot of, a lot of problem solving that, that goes into it. There's a lot of head scratching, I'm sure. Can you think of an instance where you were just like, I don't know what, why this isn't working. And you, and you guys have put your heads together, brainstormed a solution and had the solution come to fruition. I mean, yeah, even the new stuff, the coyotes, you know, once in a while you get a motor that is not doing what it's supposed to be doing. And two instances, you know, um, we have this big event, dream cruise every year in Michigan.

12:54It's a million people come to this thing, right. And, and everybody puts these, these deadlines, like I got to have her dream cruise. I'm like, get you and everybody else. I get it. So we're trying, we try to accommodate. And then we had one motor that, um, we fired two days before dream cruise and we were hustling to make that work. And we have a low oil pressure situation and I'm like, this is not good. It's a brand new zero mile motor. And in that case, the solution, this owner wanted this car for dream cruise.

13:25We ordered, uh, um, a motor from power by the hour, a long block, had it shipped to us from Florida to Michigan. And in, in one night we switched out the motor and ever, I mean, that's a lot of work and, and, you know, had the thing running. So I could show up at his, uh, big tent on Woodward Avenue and have the car ready. So that was a huge thing. You know, now I've got that other motor on the side and I've, you know, I've torn out. I think there's something going on with the oil pump that caused that issue, but that, that's something that, you know, that's one way of solving it.

13:59The other issue is an, and you know, we had a, those predator GT 500, there's 760 horsepower motors. And we had some real problems with, uh, end play. And, um, it was kept making a noise every time you touch that clutch pedal. I finally found out two days ago what the issue was. And it was, um, the thrust bearing was wiped out, but it, it, I had to take the whole engine apart to find out the issue. And, you know, again, I had some very skilled people who helped me through that process and, um, to get it to go fixed.

14:30You can't just throw that motor out. It's a lot of money. You know, mastering, uh, a, uh, a build is one thing. Juggling the mastering of many big, of many builds at the same time is another. Typically, how many of these do you have going on in your, in your shop? Um, we usually have eight or nine cars in the shop at one time. I would say five or six of those are, are, uh, big builds like full restorations. This, those super build cars, there's usually one or two.

15:02And then there's, um, where you have a 66 GT three 50 right now, a Shelby GT three 50 is a very authentic. So we usually have one of those last year. We did a boss row to write down to, you know, the slop gray undercarriage paint to all the little suspension marks and coatings. Um, so we still get those, these are people who's had the cars forever and, um, you know, luckily they, they bought them for under $2,000 and, you know, they're worth a lot of money now, but the restorations are pretty intense.

15:33And a lot of them have rust issues and that you get, you know, rather significant, um, bills every month to get the cars right. But, but when we're done, they're right. And they're, they're good. But as a, uh, as a guy that's running the shop, overseeing it, um, what are some of the worries or concerns that you have? You know, we always, we, as the consumer, we're always thinking, oh man, I hope this doesn't cost me an arm and a leg to get it through the process. Or I hope we're close on the estimation, even a $75,000 estimation, you know, when it comes down to it, it's just an estimate.

16:05You don't really know until you fully get into it. It could be 90,000 or a hundred grand. And then you got to be the one as the owner to go back to the, uh, of the, uh, the owner of the vehicle and say, Hey, look, we underestimated this, or there is other things that need to get done. How, how, how does that work in your day to day? Well, so you try to avoid those conversations, um, at, at the end of the game. Right. So the biggest thing I think for me is constant communication with clients to say, here's where we're at. This is what's going on. This is what we see.

16:35And then, you know, we, we do that through photographs, phone calls, uh, site visits. So there isn't one big, Oh, wow. This is huge. This bill, I had no idea. Right. So you, you have to temper expectations and you have to communicate often so they know why you're doing it. It's not like we're, I think my famous line, I say this every time is I'm not trying to get rich off one guy. Cause it's, you know, it's, there's, I am very cognizant of the cost of these things. And I think I've mentioned this before. I, I always questioned like, wow, would I pay all that money for this car?

17:10You know, cause I get it. I used to be that guy on that side who went to a shop and say, please paint it. And, you know, can you tell me how much it costs? But, you know, sometimes you can't tell them until you get into it, especially paint work until you media blast a car. Everybody, you know, my famous thing, you know, it's pretty solid. I'm like, Oh, okay, cool. Let's have that conversation after we media blast it. And it comes back and they're like, Oh, wow. I had no idea. I'm like, yeah, I kind of had an idea. Cause it always is. There's always some surprises, pleasant surprises come once in a while, but usually the other surprises are usually finding Mustangs are the majority of the, of the things you're working on.

17:44I think I, I think I saw on your Instagram page, uh, you had an old, I don't even know what it was, a Belair or something. Yeah. Yeah. So there are, we've got a couple, uh, neat in cars there, but we're still known for our Mustangs and our Shelbys. Um, we've done several Broncos. Um, but we do have a, a Belair in there. That's a cool car. It's an art Morrison frames, got an, um, LT four supercharged motor. Um, we have, uh, something you might like, Doug. It's a 55 F two 50. Nice. And, um, and we've done our share of the off brand, the other brands, GM, the Camaros and stuff like that.

18:19So, um, you were not opposed to doing that type of work. I think it gives everybody a little bit of a refresher, you know, after Mustang, after Mustang, after Mustang, it's good to give some mental diversion there for guys. So, so that, that in addition to, uh, also having a personal life, I know you have, uh, is it your, is Leo, is that your grandson? Yeah. Leo. Yeah. That's great. Yep. My grandson, Leo is very big part of our lives and very active in our life. So, uh, he likes to shop. I take his little guys, his Buzz Light years and Woody's, and I put them on air cleaners. And I take photos and send them to my wife, Kim, and he loves that stuff.

18:52And he's, he's always his famous sign. I need to borrow this. And he's borrowing tools. And I've given them the model cars that last about 30 minutes. And there's one tire left on them. And like, yeah, I don't know if you've, uh, are you a YouTube, uh, fan at all? Do you go to, do you watch any of the channels on, on YouTube at all? Oh, yeah, not, not a lot, but I like stuff. I like content. So for, for our, uh, Ford Mustang and Ford truck communities and anybody that is, is newly listened to the show. And, and for you too, Jim, of course, there is a, uh, there's a YouTube channel.

19:24It's called, uh, his, it's at Simon Fordman Fordman. And I, I think that's his, uh, that's his, just his pen name. And he does this, um, artistic version. He's, uh, I think he was a film major or something like that in college or maybe in school. And in addition to, he is a hugely talented guy working with the wrench too. I mean, he goes out and he buys these vehicles. He stops in and just gets a, you know, like a, a Husky, uh, a socket wrench set. And he's doing all this amazing stuff with his little socket wrench set, which leads you

19:56to believe that you really don't need all the tools in the world that we all think that we need in order to get the job done. It's just the right tools sometimes do work a little bit better. Anyway, uh, basically there might be five or 10 words in the entire two hour video that he's put together, but he's what he's doing through artistic use of the camera or cameras. He's doing this great stuff with the build. I would love, love, love to see a motor city grind YouTube channel that has some of this stuff going down in full, you know, I'm happy to take a 10 hour video and watch it.

20:30These enthusiasts, we can't get enough information about how to do stuff because we're all learning at the same time. Can you remember that part in your life when you were just learning how to do all this stuff? Yeah, very much. And it was way before YouTube, right? So you had to get pictures mailed to you or you'd try to find some guy through several phone calls. It, it was, it was kind of hard back then. Now it's pretty, it's pretty cool that we have access like to what you're mentioning and other places for sure. And even the pros, you know, we, we go and we look, look at what other people are doing

21:03too, because there's a lot of new products out there and, you know, we are a little bit particular about what we install in a car to make sure that it is a sound product. So that's a great way to learning and find out, you know, other people's experiences and, you know, we'll apply our, our knowledge and, um, and expertise to that too. But yeah, I just think about things like, you know, doing a, doing a brake job, you know, or doing a transmission rebuild for, for the faint at heart, a transmission rebuild is not the place to start. I mean, I think about all of the little tiny bits and bites and pieces and parts that are

21:36inside that transmission and think, how the hell do you ever remember all those clutch plates? A lot of photos, a lot of photos done. So many things that have to get done. And, uh, do your guys specialize in one specific thing? Like you have a specific body guy or a specific paint guy or a specific brake guy. Is that how that works? We, we definitely have, you know, our, our painter, I'll put them up against anybody's phenomenal at paint. Um, and he can tell when a car is ready to be painted and when it's not ready to be painted,

22:07that's a huge benefit for everyone. Really. Um, we have, uh, very talented body, body guys that are, are really good at doing body work. That's their main core expertise that they do in the shop. And then we have assembly guys. I, I help out on the assembly, but I've got some, um, another guy who's very good at wiring like in this, the wiring now is getting more complicated than it was a five, you know, fuse little fuse things, the blocks and the old Mustang. So, um, we all have our, our core expertise, but the nice thing, going back to your point

22:41earlier about how, uh, the passion to do these jobs, all these guys have their own cars. They're all, you know, uh, a couple of guys have Mustangs. Another guy's got a 59 Apache. The other guy's got a Lamont's and, and so, and I don't know, they go home and they do this stuff at night. So they love it and they're good at it. You know, I know that one of our body guys is very good at, he has a 69 Mustang. So he puts a lot of our 69, 70 Mustangs together because he just, he knows them inside out, you know?

23:11So I like that we can span the range a little bit that helps us for shop flow because sometimes they're heavy and body and light and assembly and vice versa. Right. Right. But it helps offset that for sure. So, but they do have their expertise and, but they also have specialization and a lot of other areas that help us, uh, produce the cars and, and stay on what I think is really good schedules, you know, for people and meeting deadlines. You, uh, you mentioned a little bit earlier, the importance of, of hiring the right people,

23:41putting the right people on the bus, you know, the culture of the company is, is, is paramount to, uh, to making a quality product on, on the end side of things. How do you decide, how do you pick those people? You know, a resume is one thing and maybe, uh, you know, personal references or another, but until you get to see them in action, you don't have any idea what their attitude is all about, unless they've really done a good job of snowing you in the interview. So, well, I have been snowed in the past. I'm not going to lie, Doug. And I always, you know, but that is, uh, that's really, it's difficult getting the right people in there who have the talent, but also have the attitude, the ability to work

24:15with others. Um, we are, and I, I say that, you know, I think I've got the ability to work with others. The best team we've had in a long time about guys that are, they know each other's strengths and weaknesses. So they offset and they support. Um, and, but the attitude is everything. You can get one bad seat in a shop and it, it'll wreak havoc. And, you know, all of a sudden it's, it's a, the talk about the problems and not a talk about what we're doing and what we're driving and trying to, you know, push towards. So as an owner, you have to be pretty swift about it.

24:46You know, you got to analyze it back. Cause not every interview you think, yo, this guy's going to work out just fine. And, you know, sometimes it takes a little while to understand, like he's not the right fit and for him and for us too, or whoever the person is, it's gotta be the right fit. You know, going back to some initial conversations that we have, and this is years ago when we, when you first came on the show for the first time. And I remember, I think at that point you had either, how long have you had your shop? Uh, 2016 technically. So eight, eight years, I think by the time we were really taking on clients.

25:18Yeah. All right. So we've had the show for probably six or seven years now. And I think early on you were a guest on the show and I remember you had maybe two or three in the shop and that was like to your capacity. You know, you're like, so, so, you know, as the business grows, which most business owners want to grow, uh, at some point it begins to take a life of its own and you have other people that are helping manage the other people within your organization. Cause it's hard to get your arms around everything. Have you experienced that, that, um, that I guess scale in your, in your business where

25:48you have other people managing to, um, I might be a little bit unique in terms of where I'm at in my life and my age. And, you know, I, this, this move was a total passion play. I left the architectural world and I said, this is something I really want to do. Yeah. So I've been blessed to have the ability to start a business, kind of maintain the scale of it the way I want to. So I still have oversight and, um, and, you know, I get to pick the people that I want to work with and, and the clients that we want to work with.

26:19So we have not, we could grow this. I mean, the backlog certainly could support more people if we wanted to do that. But, you know, I, I left that world kind of like, I didn't want to become an HR guy. I wanted to be somebody who's, you know, into the builds and passionate. And I, I enjoy talking with clients. So I enjoy giving clients the time that they deserve and that they, you know, they need to help them with their build. So if I were to scale that up, um, I'm not sure if that, that kind of personalization is there and I'm okay with it. You know, I, I've, um, I've kind of like, I like kind of our sweet spot where we are and

26:54the amount of work that we have. We could add more. We certainly could. No, I, I don't, I'm not forcing you to, and I'm not telling you that you're, that you're not, I, I, you know, it's, it's interesting. I think you, you capped it nicely at the beginning of that, the answer where you said, look, I'm in a position in my life where I, I, I, I could have done that when my architecture business, but I, you know, I guess I could do that in my, I don't want to, I don't want to, I want to get my arms around all of the customers that come in. And I, I don't want to hire three levels of management because you said it again, quite eloquently that I don't want to be an HR guy.

27:24I want to be a guy that's still doing my, my thing and, and, and enjoying it. How does that feel as someone that's able to, to do that? Or maybe, maybe the answer is, man, it's a bunch of fricking headaches. I can tell you that, but I still love doing it. I think there's, there's definitely days you have your headaches, right? Not everything always goes the way you want it to, but, um, it bounces back pretty quick because I just see a lot of things that we're, we're doing and, you know, I'm, I'm really proud of the product that we keep, uh, producing and for, for our clients.

27:56And, and, you know, I just see the guys too developing and doing their, their thing. And I like being around, I like being surrounded by that talent. Right. So it makes me better and it makes me appreciate the stuff that we do. So for me, I, um, I really like being around the cars and I, you know, I'm at the age where I'm like, well, shoot, I could probably retire or do something else. But sometimes I'm like, what am I going to do? I'll probably go work on cars. Right. That's the kind of the thing that restarted another business that you got right now. So you may as well stay in the business. Yeah, exactly.

28:27But, you know, I know that, you know, I've got guys on the team that are anxious to move up in the ranks and stuff like that. So I'm, um, I'm aware of that. And, you know, I, I think there's good at some point there will be a smooth transition or

Business Growth and Management

28:40something to, you have a built-in transition plan already. You got those guys that are the most talented. They're making their way up to the, to the top. They want to get a little closer to you and figure out what you're doing and how you're doing it. You just start handing off some of those management and customer facing responsibilities over to them and see how you do. And, and the true test is, and I know you love vacation, go on vacation for a week or two or a month and don't check in and see how it goes. And yeah, that's, that's definitely for sure.

29:12And, you know, I've, I've got a trip to California coming up this winter that it's going to be a little bit longer than normal. And that'll be a really good example. But I know, I mean, I look, I go up North on Fridays and I'm out there and I call when I need to, and they call me when they need to. So I, I've got the skillset and the talent to take care of business. That's love it. That's the, that's a huge deal. That's awesome. That's awesome. Well, you, you, you mentioned something, um, about a trip to California. Now, you know, I live in California, maybe you don't, but I live in California. If you get anywhere near the central, central coast or, or Los Angeles, Santa Barbara, let's

29:46figure out a way how to, how to, uh, how to have you, you know, drive around in one of my cars for work on your, uh, your F two 50. No, no, you don't have to work. I don't want you to work. I, you know, it's interesting. I have since found in the last year or so, I found a guy that's retired. He used to own the shop in a Ventura local to me and he sold the shop and he, um, built the shop in his backyard. So he's got a 2000 square foot shop in his backyard with, um, with two or three lifts. I can't remember any, I take him up. He, he loves, you know, he, he's got his, he works from like 11 to three and then he's,

30:19he's got his happy hour. So I'm usually there around three o'clock. So I can work on my car and do the happy hour at the same time. It's so fun to be able to have, I love the, the environment. I don't know enough about the, the mechanical side yet. I'm learning, but you know, I'm much better than I used to be, but I'm still a little, you know, I put in a starter. I've done breaks. I've done some, some stuff. That's good stuff, man. I know I, I love the plug and play stuff and it makes it a little bit easier. It's such a huge feeling of accomplishment when you're able to do stuff like this.

30:49When did that get to be a part of your, your, and I'm sure we've talked about this in the past, but when did the fascination with, with machines come to you? Oh, probably when I was going to school for architecture, I saw that movie bullet in 1991. When I, that's when I was the first Mustang I bought and I bought it, not knowing anything about the mechanical aspects of a car. You know, I was using a toothbrush to clean the engine because that's like, oh, that makes sense, you know, but, um, I just, that's, that's how it started. And I don't know how I probably had 50, 60, I don't even know Mustang fast back through

31:23the years, just buying and selling, working and playing and, you know, helped me trade up to the Shelby's and things like that. Just through all little extra mad money by buying and selling cars and driving. You know, I met a lot of interesting people throughout the country, buying cars and then picking them up. And, you know, there's always a story for every single car that I bought, every client that brings a car to me. There's always a story. And it's, it's amazes me every time I, uh, I've had the chance to buy three or four trucks through, um, and my Mustang, actually, I think I bought through Facebook marketplace or maybe

31:56a connection on, on Facebook. Most of them you buy almost sight unseen. I mean, you're going there to pick them up, but you know, you're not going to drive three hours to look at a truck and hopefully you're not going to just turn around and leave it. Cause it's got a little extra something that needs to get, I have done that on a couple of occasions. Cause I'm like, no, no, no. That little bit of surface rust, that is fricking cancer. Yeah. Yeah. I don't want to buy that. I can almost have fixed everything else other than the really bad cancer rust. And you can have that fixed, but man, I don't want to spend another 10 grand. It costs a lot to, to, uh, you got to build in a certain expectation when you're going

32:31to look at a car. Like I always expect when you buy the sight unseen, it's like, okay, I know there's going to be something wrong with this. Even if it's a really good price, there's probably, there's going to be, there's a reason for that. Right. Every time. So you just kind of build it in there. Like, yep. Yep. Yep. My, uh, $4,500 truck ended up being 15 grand by the time I'm done with the, you know, and then I can't, I'm underwater on it. I can't turn around and sell it for that. It's not, it's not, it's so it's like, okay, well there's another one in inventory for a couple of years while I, while I just kind of enjoy it, catch up, you know, I want to

33:04keep my dollars in action back on Facebook marketplace or Craigslist or finding these stuff. Um, when you go to find a, a, a vehicle, you don't do a, maybe you do. And I just, I buy cars. Yeah. Okay. So when you go to buy a car, where are you going? Um, I do a lot of marketplace, uh, probably almost all of it. You know, I'm big on the vintage Mustang forums and the, you know, classified 67, 68 fastbacks and I'm on all that stuff. But you know, the, when I was young, I'd chase, I'd be aggressive.

33:35I'd message, be the first guy. And now it's just like, oh my gosh, it's just a battle. And you know, okay. So you, once you hit it early, once in a while, you get a guy who just listed it and you can make a deal. I got a guy that, that wanted to, he literally was trying to pay his rent that month. And I'm like, okay, just tell me, tell me the price that you want. And I, cause I wasn't going to be the first one to throw the dollar. And he gave me, it was $4,000 for a truck that I probably would have paid $8,000 for. I'm not volunteering that information.

34:05I said, tell me what you want. He wanted four grand. And I'm like, I turned that, I turned that truck around for a really nice profit in a fairly quick period of time, just doing some really basic things that needed, it needed to be basically cleaned really well. Right. Deep, deep cleaning. It's amazing, isn't it? It is. And that's what got me into the whole buy sell thing. And then the next two trucks, I'm like, no, I can't, I really, I, you know, I thought they all were like that. No, no, you got to hit. Yeah. They don't always go that way. That's funny. It's all about what you buy it for, Doug. It's not what you sell it for. It's what you buy it for.

34:37It's so, it's so true. It's so true. And to find those bargains that are out there, it's really hard. Like you just said, if you're the first one and you make the right offer, you know, that's good. But if you're one, you don't want to get caught in a, in a bidding war against somebody else. And, and speaking of which evaluations right now are, are, um, are actually doing a little bit better within the last, as of the, uh, recording of this, which are, we're middle of October of 2025 valuations are actually, they're static or they're going down a little bit. Uh, I have found they're not quite getting the, you know, fastbacks are, and Broncos are probably

35:12still going for their high dollar, but you can get a great bargain out there right now because they're all just sitting, waiting for somebody to come along and, and buy it. Yeah. It's amazing. I watch all those things shoot up so fast and it's, I never pay that. I never pay that. And then, um, even the fastbacks and they have, they've come back down. They're not to where they were when I was buying all the time, but they've gone, you know, I, I would think a car that was listed a couple of years ago for 70, 80 is now probably, uh, 60 or 55, 60, you know?

35:43And then once in a while you catch one in the low forties and that's a good deal. But, you know, I used to buy cars not too long ago in the mid twenties and thinking, man, that's a lot. And I sold cars for 28 thinking I did really well. And then that shot up and then that guy's selling for 42, but it's come back. Yeah. Fast part, the fat fastback market, I think has been in the, at least in the last 10 years has been really, really high and it has recently come down a little bit, but what are like the bargains out there? What do you see in the world of, uh, in the world of, well, I think, um, I think the Mustang,

36:16I think the 65, six fastbacks are a good car. I think they're sort of catching up to 67, eights. Everybody still seems a 67, eight fastbacks are the ones they get, you know, but 65 and six, you can get some, um, nice fastbacks once in a while like that. Um, the Broncos have come down, you know, those things shot up way high, like, you know, a quarter million dollars for, uh, you know, they're cool trucks, but they're not like awesome driving machines. You know, they're, you know, you can do things to improve the suspension.

36:48We'd done the coyote swaps. We'd done all that stuff and they're nice, but they're, it's like, man, that's a lot of money for, for that car, you know? So those are switching out for scouts, uh, for, uh, Broncos are looking for scouts or some Jeep related something or other, not the same thing as the Bronco, but they still are those nice little, you know, pocket. Yeah. Uh, scouts have come up. I've noticed those. I think there's a company that's starting to make, or there's a new scout or something. So who knows, maybe that'll attract more people to buy the old stuff, but yeah, I think, you know, there's always deals we have that you, and I know you track the, um, the trucks F

37:21100s. Um, those are cool. I think they're still approachable for a lot of people, you know, that's what I like. Cause there's a lot of people that can't afford some of the stuff that frankly is a little crazy. Under 10 grand, you can get a truck for under 10 grand. Now it's not going to be like right there, ready to go on the, maybe some of them will be, they're good driving trucks, but for under 10 grand, you put another three or four into it to kind of get it up to where you, where you want it. And for under 15, you have a, a really beautiful road, road ready, cool truck. And people accept trucks with a little extra scuff on them.

37:54They do. They kind of expect it, you know, it's like, yeah, those are your battle scars. And that thing used to move hay or whatever it did never left the farm. Um, you know, yeah. Yeah. So everybody that's in our audience is probably going to be asking like, well, what, what is Jim drive? So what do you got on the road right now? I'm in an eclectic mood right now. I have my 68 fastback. I'd probably had that the last time the show has got a coyote swap. I did a lot. Unfortunately I had a little accident with it. So I redid it and I did it the way I wanted to, which luckily I had, you know, I've got a

38:25coyote over here in the corner. I've got a, you know, a manual, um, TKX over here. I've got, Hey, this interior is deluxe interior. You know, we took it out of another car. And so I was able to put that change of color, um, to a dark moss green. I really liked that color. Yeah. Um, that's bullet color, man. Bullet color. Yeah. Bullet is shit. Yep. For sure. I think that card's going to be published in the next couple of months. And, um, and Hemmings, I think we did an article in a photo shoot on it. Yeah. Um, we, I've got, uh, uh, a race car replica GT 40 that I've been building for 12 years.

38:58That has just been the slowest build ever. And it's just, I can never get to it, but, um, it fired this summer. The body panels are all back on. I'm, I'm to the dialing in phase. That's cool. Um, now I have a 71 911 Porsche air-cooled car that I really enjoy and probably one of the cooler cars I bought in a while is a 71 Datsun 240Z. Nice. I bought that car original out of, um, California. Yeah. Great car. I, I, you know, driving that thing, it's such a pleasurable experience.

39:30And so I'm really into that. And I bought an old Bronco, original paint Bronco. That's like that car that you said, you know, you always got to work on it. And I, that thing has left me stranded like three times this summer. I'm like, Oh my gosh. And so it's one, it's just hasn't been touched for years, you know, and you find out what goes wrong, you know, like, Oh, you know, the radiator went out, the carburetor to be rebuilt. The fuel tank was leaking, um, all a bunch of the ignition module was screwed up and it

40:00just, it just, it's the car that keeps on giving me headaches, frankly. But the important question is, what is your wife driving right now? Cause we know that that's going to be the dependable car in the family. Well, yeah, she drives a Toyota, uh, four runner, right? I got a car, but, um, right now we're, we're a little busy with all the other stuff. So she's got a very reliable car. Yeah, man. I, I, I don't, I don't blame you. I see, I see her cart in the grandkid around that. I'm, I'm sure that definitely want to put that child in a safe, safe, safe, heavy car.

40:30That's right. That's right. Yeah, man. What should I be asking you that we haven't talked about today? There's been so, there's so many topics that have been on the, uh, on the plate and I, I so enjoy having you on the show and just shooting the crap with you at once. No, I appreciate the time and you reaching out. It's been, it has been a little while, but you know, I think for the most part, life is good, right? You just, you, um, we're working, we're busy. That's our, you know, it's a blessing to be busy. Um, where we enjoy going up North on Lake Huron. That's our kind of a getaway.

41:01Um, and you know, hopefully a little bit travel. Like I said, the winter, I think every winter, it gets a little harder to be here in Michigan, frankly. So we're trying to mix that up a little bit with some travel and, and like, we'll be probably in your neck of the woods in, um, January, February. I think my wife will take an extended stay and I'll go out there for a little while. Nice. Nice. Well, very cool. Well, as always, it's been a, it's been a pleasure and wonderful catching up with you, Jim. And I, and I appreciate you, you sharing. And for those in our community that don't know much about, uh, Jim Chattis or Motor

41:34City Grind, you definitely want to take a look at his Instagram page. I'll put a link in the, uh, the show notes for that. And, um, yeah, I think, I think we're good. Yeah. Thanks, Doug. I appreciate it again. The time it was great to catch up. Yeah. You as well. So Ford Mustang community for truck community. Thanks for hanging out another day. Keep it safe, keep it rolling and keep it on the road until next time. Thanks for listening to the Ford Mustang first generation, the early years podcast, please subscribe, rate and review wherever you listen to your podcasts ideas for the show. Click the link in the show notes.

42:04Thanks again for tuning in. I'll see you in the next video. Thank you.

42:14Thanks, Stu. Thank you. Thank you.